/balding/ and /finasteride/ general - hair is love, hair is life!Sticky: http://tuxbell.com/index.php/BaldingReminder that if you can clearly see down to your scalp when your hair is wet, your hair is thinning, lots of small new hairs sprouting at the hairline or crown is a sign of hair recession.Holy trinity:Tabs: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FinasterideLotion: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MinoxidilShampoo: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KetoconazoleFinasteride/Dutasteride are 5-alpha reductase inhibitors that prevent free T from being converted to DHT, a byproduct of testosterone that serves no purpose after puberty but to choke out your hair follicles and make them thin out and die in a few short years, a condition known as androgenic alopecia.5ar inhibitors prevent your hair from getting any worse, mild regrowth is expected, rapid onset diffuse thinners see a significant recovery on fin alone. Can be taken orally or topically.5ARIs are not dosage dependent, taking as little as as 0.2mg daily fin can reduce serum DHT by 68%, while 5mg reduces by 72%.0.5mg daily dut reduces serum DHT by 95%, but is considered a second line treatment, and can be more expensive and harder to get prescribed. Start with fin.Fin has been used to treat benign prostatic hyperplasia (BPH) for 30+ years, it's very well studied and is tolerated well in almost all men, however, there's a 1-2% risk of erectile issues in controlled studies.These can be avoided by reducing dosage, spacing out dosage, or stopping the drug. Fin takes days to fully bio-accumulate, the half life of fin is about 8 hours, adverse effects occuring within minutes of starting fin or persisting long after stopping fin are not real and have no basis in reality. Please note that dut has a much higher half-life of 5 weeks, if you're prone to fin sides, dut may cause them for far longer.Refer to https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3481923/ before responding to PFS trolls.
Minoxidil (liquid and tabs) is a vasodialator that opens potassium channels and widens blood vessels bringing nutrients to your hair follicles, stimulating them into thickening, accelerating growth and elongating the growth phase. Min is taken with fin to restore your hair to it's original hairline, thickness and vigor when hair loss is caught early enough, (pre-NW2). Can be taken orally or topically.Topical min does not work in 1/3 of men because they lack the required enzymes in their scalp, all men have this enzyme in their liver so the oral route is a good fallback.The FDA formulation for 5% liquid minoxidil is food safe (vape juice, ethanol and water) and can be safely taken orally if oral min tabs are expensive or rarely prescribed where you live. As a general rule, ~4 drops (0.1ml) = 5mg minoxidil.There's a 1-2% risk of fluid retention with higher oral dosages, start with the lowest dosage possible and work your way up when you're sure it's well tolerated.Ketoconazole is an anti-androgen and antifungal that inhibits DHT on the scalp and used to treat fungal infections of the scalp that may be making your hair loss worse such as seborrheic dermatitis, a condition where you exhibit severe greasy, flaky large dandruff flakes with dried yellow crystals (blood plasma) embedded in the scalp. Some people may only have traction alopecia (hair loss from scratching or friction), but it will not cure androgenic alopecia on it's own. Can only be taken topically.Do not use spirolactone. Spirolactone is a diuretic which, in large doses, inhibits testosterone and, by extension, DHT.It is regularly prescribed as an anti-androgen for male to female HRT, and thus, comes with an astronomically higher risk of sexual side effects in men including ED, gynecomastia, and can cause potassium toxicity.Previous thread: >>18780016
why do finasteride advocates downplay the role of DHT in the body?Serious question and I looked it up as I'm about to start finasteride.Apparently it's pretty important for penile tissue, as well as sperm fluid production, those two are already pretty big bodily aspects. And sure testosterone replaces some of that activity, but only for the penile tissue part. It seems like reduced cum amount and more transparent cum as well as reduced fertility is a guaranteed side effect from fin, simply due to basic human biology. The rest seems like nocebo or lack of testosterone able to compensate DHT activity.
>>18786597It's unlikely I will ever have children so I don't care about my sperm quality. I deliberated for 2-3 years on whether to start fin, in the end I realised I value my appearance a lot and was willing to take a risk to save my hair, though I only take half the usual dose.
>>18786597Give it a rest
I have a schizo theory that hair matters more now that in the recent past because people don't look others in the eyes anymore so they focus on things that are around them, like the hair. When you look someone in the eyes, the face is a primary focus point and hair is secondary, but if you avoid looking in the eyes, you'll be more likely to focus on hair
>>18786982There has never been a single blip in all of known history where a head of hair wasn't highly valued.
Just ordered fin, wish me luck boys At least if I get a lump dick I'll have an actual reason to kms
>>18787210thats the spirit
>>18787124You're so knowledgeable, you must be a professor or something
>>18787248Hey man maybe one day we will discover a species of human that went underground and became hairless. You might be treated like a god amongst them with your eyebrow hair intact.
>>187865843 months into topical min+fin and the difference is night and day. my scalp was almost completely exposed but now it just looks thin. my temples are quite receded but i can see small baby hairs developing there. will those baby hairs become full hairs with time or will they stay stunted?also, 0 side effects so far.
>>18787314>small baby hairs developing thereAre they pigmented?
>>18787316they do seem slightly darker and scruffier than the rest of the baby hairs on my face. not sure if that's real hair or if they're just getting "fertilized" by the min+fin
>>18787323Sounds like they are terminal hairs then. Vellus hairs would be colorless, soft and nearly imperceptible to the naked eye. That being said they may forever remain in a miniaturized state or recover enough to fill in your hairline, only time will tell.
>>18786584Finasteride for 10 months, been going through a second synchronized shed and it's been absolutely brutal, lads. Hairline itself hasn't moved but I've definetly taken a hit on density, might get a buzzcut while those hairs grow back. Also been thinking of putting topical minoxidil on the stack, still worth it even if I think finasteride has more or less stabilized my balding?
>>18786597Because testosterone does literally everything DHT does without making you go bald. Blocking DHT isn't even the primary cause of side effects from 5ar inhibitors, it's the extra testostorene turning into estrogen because your aromatase activity is too strong.
>>18787512>Also been thinking of putting topical minoxidil on the stack, still worth it even if I think finasteride has more or less stabilized my balding?If you care about regrowth or minmaxing your hair gains, yes, min is invaluable. If all you want is to maintain and thicken what you have (with maybe a milimeter or two of hairline gains over years) then stay on fin only.
>>18787519>with maybe a milimeter or two of hairline gains over yearsFin doesn't magically regrow your hairline
>>1878751210 months in, do you think fin has helped you? Not to sound like a conspiratard but I feel like many people start fin and then suddenly lose like half their hair while blaming it on temporary shedding kek
>>18787526If you have very weak but visible miniaturized hairs at the edge of your hairline, those can come back with fin.
>>18787528Mixed bag. My thinning crown got covered up pretty good, used to be a straight up bald spot 10 months ago but now you can only tell it's thinning if my hair's wet. Hairline hasn't receded any further(maintaining a norwood 2 basically) but overral density in the front has gotten... Worse after this second shed, but it should grow back. Should. I've been considering minoxidil to speed it along.
>>18787544>overral density in the front has gotten... Worse Fuggggg now I'm doubly scaredThe only reason I want to start min is to improve my shitty thinning front, I'm not balding in the back yet
>>18787547>minI meant fin ofc not min
>>18787547Why are you afraid of a temporary shed? You know what happens with unchecked balding right?
>>18787633It seems like it wasn't a temporary shed tho; see his reply >>18787544A temporary shed isn't supposed to last 10 months
>>18787656Nice reading comprehension
Why can’t you guys just spend some money on a decent hair system if hair is that big of a deal? Custom made ones are undetectable if styled well and ever since I got one it’s made my life much easier since I don’t have to worry about styling my hair to cover up thinning and people say I finally look normal.
>>18787848Because it would be living a lie. Hair transplant, meds, or embrace. Everything else just isn't it. Happy it works for you though but I could never. Imagine meeting a girl and explaning that to her. Sure maybe the ideal one will understand, but you will forever change in her eyes and a foundational part of your relationship(physical attraction) will be based on a lie.
Not sure if this is the right thread for this, but I'm sick of still having a bunch of stubble after shaving, what are good razors?I know single blade ones are considered the best but I am also a pussy and am scared of cutting myself a bit.Frankly I'm outright considering laser treatment, if anybody has info on that, and if it will mean my hair growth is slowed like 2x to 3x and/or it will get rid of the visible greyness on my chin and below my nose from stubble
>>18787923Shave against the grain, lol.
>>18787848>Why can’t you guys just spend some money on a decent hair system if hair is that big of a deal?I honestly would do it, IF not for the following things>in contrast to hair transplants, hair systems are socially not really acceptable for men and you'll be embarrassed if strangers find out >hair systems are expensive as fuck, think 1000+ bucks per year >hair systems are maintenance intensive, every 3 weeks you have to reapply and restyle >you constantly will be nervous about the hair system not malfunctioning >if you have an itchy/sweat scalp you're doubly fucked >hair systems still aren't perfect, it doesn't feel like "your hair" when you touch the base, and other people running their fingers through your hair also feel it So for most people getting a hair transplants and hopping on meds seems like the cheaper and easier alternative.
>diffuse thinning>shave for more than a decade>hop on fin min too late>it fucking works>got nice hair I can comb, slightly still thin>side effect: increased libidoEverything sounds good, right?>heavy shedding 5 months in>hair looks so bad that I have to shave (almost as bad as pic rel)Idc if it's temporary and new healthy hairs are supposed to replace them. It looks awfulJ U S T
>>18787946Haven't started fin yet, but supposedly the dread shed can last up to 6 months, although the high phase is early on and it gradually stabilises Keep in mind there's also these things>seasonal shedding, many people shed towards late summer/autumn (yes this is a real thing)>stress>malnutrition>fin is simply not effective enough for you
>>18787957Ok now I started fin. Wish me luck
>>18787957Now I startedWish me luck
>>18788044>>18788046Wtf
I've been on dutasteride 0.5 mg daily for 7 months but if I skip a few days my libido goes up and I have an easier time talking to people. There shouldn't be any change in steady state levels, so there shouldn't be a noticeable difference, right?
>>18788067We call that textbook nocebo
>start finasteride>already think my hair looks slightly better not even 6 hours later Holy placebo
>>18788324I swear to god my hair started falling less about a week in
>>18788325Biologically impossible afaik
>>18788329To elaborate: Hairs that fall out "start" falling out like several months ago, with some exceptions, because that's the phase they're in. Finasteride doesn't switch that phase to "growing" from "falling out", but makes the next "growing" phase longer + makes sure the "falling out" phase doesn't turn into "fall out and never grow again"
Hairloss will be fully solved in the 2040s btw. Sadly, we were born just a little too late anons.>2000-2013First commercial attempts fail. Intercytex and Aderans run human trials with weak results and shut down>2012 to 2023Fully functional follicles regrown in mice, methods to keep cells hair-inducing, stem cell and organoid routes grow human follicles in mice.>2024-2026Shiseido launches a follicle-reviving cell therapy in Japan, HairClone starts human treatments offshore>2028-2035Advancements in Lab-grown human follicles that reliably mature and survive transplant, Consistent growth direction and normal cycling, no tumor risk>2035-2040Multi-year trial data showing durability, GMP manufacturing that gives consistent quality per patient>2040+Automated production of thousands of follicles per patient, mass commercialisation via hair transplants clinics cooperating with labs, "cure"-level treatments are affordable on the mid 5 digit level in today's money
>>18788337Dude I was 16 years old fully ready to take propecia for life the day I turned 18 and then I was told the same cope about "just wait 5 years for something better" so I waited until my 20s and then I was balding. Those frontal temple hairs never came back. It's easier to start a massive information campaign informing people that the ONLY way to SAVE your hair from genetic baldness is to be on propecia or avodart. The "cure" being infinite grafts also is bogus imo. Because they still have to "recreate" your hairline with grafts, you don't grow your 14 year old head of hair back.
>>18788337You'll still have to take fin or prepare for numerous transplants throughout your life.
>>18788342>You'll still have to take fin no you want, the lab grown hairs will be dht resistant>numerous transplants throughout your lifeThat's true although numerous might be overstated. Some surgeons already do 10k+ graft megasessions, and presuming you're at nw7 or some shit, you'll need "only" 30-50k hairs so 3 sessions
Lads, it's officially over.I can deal with losing hair on the front, but thanks to a video I just got I realized there's a bald spot on the back now too. Despite being on dut for years. Non-responder to minox.I give up. I'm going to buzz it all off and you can find me on r/bald in the future. It was nice knowing you.Alternatively, even better in fact, somebody shoot me please.
>>18788413What about hair transplants? You seem like you have full hair otherwise.Also honestly surprising it didn't help, I thought fin and dut are particularly efficient for the crown. How old are you anon?
>>18788413did you try oral minoxidil or just topical?
How do you guys feel about the PFStards?It's hard for me to estimate,some of these reports are absolutely hilarious, shit like "I took a single pill and it RUINED MY LIFE" or absolutely esoteric side effects like not getting drunk from alcohol lmao.But I'm sure there's a subset of people who legitimately struggled to recover after moderate to severe side effects from the pill for a while , must be frustrating as hell
>>18788413Time for a transplant boyo
>>18788389You need to go bald though and live with it all the way until nw5 then get 1 big transplant to avoid multiple throughout your life
>>18788413Get a hair transplant and try oral minoxidil which works for liquid minoxidil non-responders as well.
>>18788465I’m leaning towards PFS being hypochondriacs that take a while to recover from side effects. They then convince themselves that it’s forever which tanks their libido further. Also shitty lifestyles won’t help. If you’re gonna take fin you have to take care of yourself and then stay away from forums
>stable norwood 2.5>big forehead>hair at the top is about 60% the volume of the sides and back>very fine hair>get sides from dht blockers>minoxidil doesn't do shitWhat the fuck do I do with this? Any haircut suggestions? My skull shape is fine enough for a buzzcut, I've rocked it before but I would prefer to not look like an enforcer for the russian mob.
>>18788627nothing? what's there to suggest.
>>18788627You have several options >get fit, try lower dose fin >topical minoxidil>hair transplant >wigsAnd of course shaving it off
>>18787957Fin is definitely effective for me, it gave me actual hair. Even my norwood improved a bit. I think the shedding is a combination of the dread shed, seasonal, and stress.
Day 3 on finasteride Zero side effects from what I can tell My mood is slightly better I've jerked off 3 times since I started Two main thoughts rn:1) FUCK WHY DIDNT I START SOONER I COULDVE SAVED AT LEAST 1 NORWOOD2) how the fuck do I know it actually works? Seems weird but I want some "sign". I guess I'll do a blood test in six weeks or so, checking if my DHT levels are nuked
>>18788934>how the fuck do I know it actually works? your hair stays the same or gets better
>>18788413ooff. ive been on fin/dut over 15 years and minox 18 years and hair is perfectly thick except my temples. nw2 for life now. glad im not u honestly so thanks for making my day!
>>18788934>day 3please be fucking bait. how stupid are u cunt?
>>18788969What exactly is the bait?>>18788941>your hair stays the same or gets betterIt's hard to determine that unless you're 6+ months in, that was my point basicallyI'm a bit paranoid with stuff like that, what if I bought a faulty package of finasteride for example
>>187889793 days the drug can't have any effect yet. It's like that kid in high school who went to the gym 3 times and was telling other guys to feel his pecs during recess. Nothing changed yet.
>>18789097finasteride nukes your dht extremely fast, by roughly 60–70% within about 24 hours of the first dose. So not having any side effects within the first few days is already good first sign. However you are right that the most drastical changes in the body happen gradually>prostate DHT falls about 80–90% within about a week. Scalp DHT falls about 60% by around 6 weeks.>gene expression shifts within hours to days, but existing proteins take days to weeks to be replaced>Visible tissue changes take longer. For example, prostate shrinkage becomes measurable around 3 months and reaches about 20% by 6-12 months.>Testosterone and estrogen: both rise roughly 10–15% within the first few weeks and then stay stable>neurosteroids: not really known, most likely weeks to months
>>18788934>FUCK WHY DIDNT I START SOONER I COULDVE SAVED AT LEAST 1 NORWOODEverybody has this revelation. It seems like people really need to be faced with major balding before they take the plunge. It's easy to cope and shrug off subtle thinning until it becomes a big problem. I would bet a very small % of fin users are doing so proactively sadly.
I'm already 38. I don't know if getting on fin is even worth at this point.Part of me wants to go bald. I failed at life and where I haven't failed other people made sure to push me down.I started losing hair in 2023 (that's when I started to lose them, not when I started to notice. Only in the last few months things have become visible on mirror without wet hair). It wasn't much at first. Since the last 6 months I've been shedding hair fast. No, I'm not getting confused the shed with the visible effects on my scalp that took longer. I'm really losing a lot more hair.Anyway, not sure if I should even hop on fin at this point. I'm kinda okay after decades of suffering, not sure what adding this variable could do. Aside from penis side effects (I think my penis has grown in thickness since I started losing hair 3 years ago. Even my beard changed, it has become more thick and darker. It's like I completed my puberty lol), I'm mostly worried about the mental side effects. Not even depression, but an insanity of sorts.At the same time, there are so many variable in life that can change a person, why not add one that will save my hair? In theory. Because I see the crazy shed, etc.Don't know.
>>18789114For me it hurts extra because I was aware of the treatments since I was 18, and I also knew I was balding since 18.To be fair my balding was super slow, and honestly I wouldn't recommend starting fin until you're in your 20s anyway. I had a similar thought about hair transplants, and actually hair transplants aren't even recommended unless you're 25+. So I postponed all that shit into my mid 20s, then obviously life happened. After another bout of hair loss related depression I started min at 25 and told myself I'll do a hair transplant in a few years. Fin was still a no go because I was scared of the side effectsOnly when the thinning became suuuper depressing for me I thought "eh fuck it" and decided to start taking it, while now making plans for a hair transplant I'm LITERALLY picrelated except my hair is slightly better
>>18789114I know I didnt get on fin because I assumed it was some crazy expensive cosmetic drug. Maybe it is expensive in some parts of the world, but its about 20 USD for 3 months here, which is absolutely fucking nothing to anyone who might worry about losing their hair. If more people talked about the price I think more people would be more willing to look into it for their own good.
>>18789123This also a general note to guys reading it, I'm sure I'm not alone on this:I'm a very solution oriented person, and if I hate a thing about my life I try to fix it. I need to be maxing out the "fix it" part, otherwise I become depressed. For hair loss, this depression followed me for years, obviously because it got worse but also semi consciously because I knew I wasn't doing everything i could to solve my balding.In modern times, everything I could means fin + min + hair transplant.So only now that I also started fin and am about to contact clinics I have a glimmer of hopium regarding my hair loss and general depression. Even if it doesn't work out, I'll be content with the fact that I tried everything and accept being bald. But not before.
>>18789125Yeah true, I remember reading years ago online that fin is like a super expensive subscription to keep your hair, and you'll have to pay it for the rest of your life and some shit and don't you dare stop. Sounded horrible to me as a person pre job, but nowadays 30 bucks per month to keep your hair sounds hilariously cheap and affordable. I spent more than that on fast food
>>18786584Torontobros, i'm trying to get a referral to a hair loss dermatologist, but seems no one is interested in taking new hair loss patients. are there any paid dermatologists that i can get to look at my hair?
>>18789228It's pretty straight forward to self diagnose if it's balding you're worried about. Afterwards just get a script from telemedicine.
So I bought that Keeps stuff and it's only been a couple of weeks but my mustache is darker and thicker. That's not exactly what I was after here.
>>18789333Oral minoxidil makes your hair darker/thicker and increases body hair. Whatever you gained will fall out if you stop taking it but whatever remains might stay dark forever
>>18789335When does it get to the top of my head?
>>18789350how did george pull off the bald look so well?
>>18789354Nothing else you could do, skinheads were a thing back then. And he looked better with hair, as we all do.
>>18789357not really, he looks average with hair while bald he actually looks more mature without looking odd which is actually some people's type
>>18786584been on fin/min for 5 years and had no issues til about a year ago. had a pelvic floor injury and couldnt get hard for a week about a year ago. afterwards had delayed erections & lower libido. no amount of stretching and exercise helped.stopped fin/min as a test a couple days ago and have had morning wood again and erections are so much quicker. sucks to have to make this decision bc I've been known for my hair my whole life and my dad & both gpas are bald.gonna try cutting the pills in half after another week or so to see what it's like without it and see if the issue returns.I'd prefer to not have to book a damn flight to turkey or pay a fuckload for prp injections but I like have a fully working dick and not needing viagra.
>>18789529its in your head
>>18789529You literally had a physical injury its wild how you've managed to blame it on fin lol. Do you really think its likely that the last 5 years operating as normal was actually not your baseline on fin?
>>18789122>I'm already 38. I don't know if getting on fin is even worth at this point.>Part of me wants to go bald. I failed at life and where I haven't failed other people made sure to push me down.I started noticed I was thinning and receding in my late 20's. It's been 20 years and fin/fut and minoxidil totally restored my hair except my temples. I come to these threads to laugh at losers like you. Thanks for the cringe.
>>18789529Retarded.
>>18789529>5 years all good>get injured, dick immediately stops working >hmm must be the thing I started doing 5 years ago Anon, fin doesn't work like that. If anything, side effects would be gradual. Most people report side effects a few months in, i think the median was 31 days. You've been on greatly reduced fin for multiple YEARS now, by what biological mechanism would things suddenly change, if that was your baseline since basically shitton of time in terms of biology? This is a classic correlation + timing effect, your pelvic injury (+probably some mental load) lead to some issues most likely, you though it was the fin, and the symptoms got better at the same time as you stopped doing fin so you attributed them to fin
>>18789529Also, on top of that:Pelvic injuries leading to ED seems like a super common thing, based on a quick google search
