don't think i ever even encountered this guy in my playthrough

oh wait, he's that rambly guy with a kid standing outside that one building? yeah, can't say he evoked much thought from me

>>4112908
Not an RPG, not “hall of fame” worthy, its milquetoast takes on politics reek of cowardice and fear of taking a stand.

It became popular because ensouled humans have been starved of anything that resembles art. They will gorge down and exhalt anything that looks like art, like a famished man will eat worms and grass.

>>4112908
Oh, and I'm trans btw

>>4112908
Trant is ok. Just ok. There doesn't seem to be much to look at with Trant, I don't know how you can have so many thoughts. His purpose in the game is very simple (and fundamental)

I've also given it a lot of thought and I don't see the Moralintern as the villains the game makes them out to be. That is, the game projects this evil veneer onto the moralintern- and only presents caricatures on their behalf (the sunday friend and the very rich light-bending guy) and codes the organization as the puppeteers behind All The Bad Things, but it doesn't provide any rationale for their "evil." This transnational political organization of humanist values, parliamentary democracy, and incremental progress through technocratic governance is Le Evil because...??? Because bureaucratic authoritarianism can only be exclusive to the moralintern? Somehow despite making arguments about all the other sides of the political spectrum, it just doesn't make one about the Moralintern- it just fictions the Moralintern into existence, plays the villain music about them whenever it's on-screen, and that's it.

I'm also lost on their intention with Joyce and Evrart Claire. When you get past the mask that Joyce wears, she doesn't get weaker, she gets stronger- she could save Martinaise, if not Revachol, if she had any fire of revolution in her. Evrart Claire has a fire for revolution, but beyond that, he's nothing but ugly underneath. I know it all had to be intentional choices by the authors to make them this way, but the contrast just leaves me scratching my head at what they were trying to say.

>>4113014
>Not an RPG, not “hall of fame” worthy, its milquetoast takes on politics reek of cowardice and fear of taking a stand.
>its milquetoast takes on politics reek of cowardice and fear of taking a stand.
>ballwashing communism is considered centrism because he make a throwaway comment about it being gay
Namefag is deeply retarded as always.

Every single character is a monomaniac who expounds on a political concept without a shred of personality. There's no downtime, only a factional worldview.

>>4114891
The fuck does Cuno know what a rake is. Cuno's not a gardener!

>>4112908
>Trant Heidelstam
I played and finished Disco Elysium when it came out, and I cannot remember this character at all. Is this a shaggy dog joke?

>>4114898
Trant doesn't matter until the ending. He's effectively a character stand-in that "rates" how well you did in the game. He's there to grade your test, interpret the results, etc. His actual job is a psychological consultant for the police. You can interact with him before that, he's hanging around past the fishing village staring at some buildings and going on about something that has zero relevance to the events of the game(could have possibly been DLC related).

So yeah, he's relatively irrelevant. His real introduction happens after the actual game events are concluded, and the way he "grades" heavily adapts to how you played the game, right down to *how* you lost your memory (effectively making the cause of your memory loss retroactive, because his theory changes to match how you behaved after you lost your memory).

>>4114861
>>4114891
Reading these posts is deeply alienating. There's no shortage of "people" that played this murder mystery and got Disco Elysium Derangement Syndrome, because it mentions politics. The game is a walking simulator / whodunit, and one among its many gimmicks is providing surface-level jokes of major political ideologies. It's obviously played up for laughs, the developers don't seem to support one ideology over another, and it's not any deeper than that.

Your taste is shit. Your reasoning when confronted with a work of digital art is putrid dogshit. You can't be ensouled human beings. You're insects, biomass, subhuman animals. I recommend never having an opinion on anything again. Just shut up and play games meant for you, like Wolverine, where you must follow a "scent trail", and you can't misinterpret the product.

the retard speaks

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>>4114921 >>4126184

>>4114902
>It's obviously played up for laughs, the developers don't seem to support one ideology over another, and it's not any deeper than that.

>>4114915
They can say whatever they want, it always felt like within the work itself they were saying desperately clinging to these ideologies is for broken men who have lost control of their lives.

>>4114921
The stance within the game is that everything is shit, but fascism is more shit than everything else.
If anything it champions moralism more than communism because while it never accomplishes anything and everyone is miserable at least there aren't firing squads and genocides.

>>4113970
Because the writers are clearly edgelord euroskeptic putinbots.

>>4112908
About this game, how can anyone sympathize with any of the female characters? Klaasje is the worst case but even Harry's ex was a piece of shit. Harry's addicted to the al-gul because his child was murdered and he has to live with the person he loved the most in the world being the one who did it. It also says a lot about how she was when you finally let her leave but she still tries to get the last word in.

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>>4114921
Cope. This is just the same performative Nihilism championed by the likes of Rick and Morty fans/writers. The current state of the writer of DE gives context behind his mindset when writing this.

The Author doesn't think this is a centrist game.
Commies don't think that it is a centrist game.
Right-wingers don't think that it is a centrist game.
A namefag thinks it is a centrist game.

What actual argument can you make for this game besides all of the tired cliches from journos?

>>4114927
The fact that Moralism is considered the "Centrist option" shows how far-Left the game actually is.

>>4114963
The Dolores scene wasn't a flashback, it was a dream. That was stuff in his head. You can speak to his ex, actual, on the payphone, and she's nothing like that- she's exactly like a distant ex who's moved on, in another world, would be like when a clearly distraught lover from her past calls.

The female characters are just as fine as the male characters. There's the dice maker, the fisherwoman you can go on a date with, JOYCE, the cryptozoologist's wife, the former operator of the whirling in rags. Klaasje is the worst of course, but she's also the center of the plot, so of course she is.

>>4114963
>how can anyone sympathize with any of the female characters?
Wow, you’re clearly only fascist because you hate women

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>>4115092

>>4112908
For me, it's René, the superior racisté.
But for real, in the end he just seems sort of noble in ways that Measurehead could never be.
I think it's this idea of sacrifice for his country that Measurehead could merely talk about but old René has actually done which sets them apart.

>>4115086
Rene is also my favorite. I can't help but admire the grognard. It's made him miserable, but his commitment to fatalism has a kind of dignity. The monarchy failed, its defenders, including him, weren't strong enough. To try to wipe that slate would mean it all meant nothing. The kingdom of revachol had to be able to die, and its death has to be final, or nothing has any significance and it all means nothing. He'd rather wallow in his failure in a real world than choose to soften reality in any form. A mensh in his own way. Probably not a role model though. It's also neat how much he grinds on the deserter. Despite Rene's despair, he is still in the world. And the deserter hates him for it.

>>4115080
I actually got mad after reading other people’s posts about how it’s the right thing to let Klaasje and Ruby go instead of arresting and attempting to arrest them because I expected interesting content to be unlocked only for me to get duped into letting them dodge all accountability for nothing in return

>>4113970
>I'm also lost on their intention with Joyce and Evrart Claire. When you get past the mask that Joyce wears, she doesn't get weaker, she gets stronger- she could save Martinaise, if not Revachol, if she had any fire of revolution in her. Evrart Claire has a fire for revolution, but beyond that, he's nothing but ugly underneath. I know it all had to be intentional choices by the authors to make them this way, but the contrast just leaves me scratching my head at what they were trying to say.
I took this as their respective institutions corroding and uplifting them respectively. Joyce could have been great if she didn't dedicate her life to banal evil and even someone like Evrart can be useful for the right cause.

>>4116085
>accountability
Fascist!

>>4114902
Now make your word salad into a 300 post thread and you've got the introduction to average Disco Elysium character after you ask them if they've seen the flying cryptozoology mosquito prick.

>>4113017
Alright.

>>4113970
The entire game takes place in a bombed out ruin which the moralfags have had control over for decades. There should probably be material evidence of their ideology’s superiority, no?

>>4113970
It's been a while since I played this but the Moralintern is just a mask, the amalgamation of the Ultralib greediness and Dolores Dei ideology.

Joyce is the clear example of that.

>She could save Revachol [..]

She is just an employee anon, her power amounts to hiring a couple of mercenaries/muscle in this case

You need to understand Martinaise war was a civil war that was co-opted by the MoralInterm (Foreign power) and ended with the annexation/vassalage of the island.

>>4116188
that's really insightful anon

>>4125458
>It's been a while since I played this but the Moralintern is just a mask, the amalgamation of the Ultralib greediness and Dolores Dei ideology.
if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, is it not a duck? How does it matter what is beneath the mask

>she is just an employee
then Evrart is just a really fat man

>you need to understand
yes I know it thoroughly, but (foreign power) and its (vassalage) doesn't make a statement in itself. at all. and with that
>>4124996
it's material evidence on the quality of the people living in martinaise. the deserter says exactly that, too, and he's been in position to see it. If your own experience through the game wasn't enough for you to see it too.

>>4114927
>at least there aren't firing squads and genocides
one of the "endearing" quirks of PRACTICED communism is that there is always something available to shift the blame for brutality, including when one's own tribe has inflicted immeasurable damage on a population (as much through genocidal "social" praxis as through more flagrant massacres). foremost of these causes of course is capitalism. the fact that trant seems to touch on this in his dialogue in OP's pic will never change the actual behaviour of communists/marxists. they will deride the very antics that they continue to engage in. as long as there is the capability to churn out muh historical-material "critique" en masse with a straight face, you are in the green of the "consciousness" spectrum and you can do the very same thing you declare abhorring. compound this if you're the type who sees themself as larger-than-life and too cool for good and evil, which is how you end up with socialists/communists "managing" all sorts, a surprising range of "reactionary" ideologies in the shadows of society while meandering zombie faggots in their lower ranks with not half a brain pull off the lovey-dovey socialist act to win hearts and minds.
and all of this jovial socialist faggorty is possible because they took an important word, and slapped "-ism" at its end. this is how you end up with creatures who could not be more alien to a thing taking ownership of that very thing.

>>4114915
and just as these flunkies so defiantly shout these totally forbidden names in this totally capitalistic society, let us state away our truth: the fact that foundations do not exist means that marxism as publicly formalized for more than a century is false.

Reminder that if you check the medicine cabinet for Klaasje’s gift after she escapes depending on your choices it’s implied Kim gets convinced by Harry to start doing speed.

>>4112908
this whole game reads like an ironic lefty rant that somehow still manages to sound smug

>>4126644
Somehow?

>>4113970
IRL you can scratch any european and under a micron of paint they're in love with US state department style atlanticism so they can't come up with any real critique of it

>>4126748
Because for a microstate like Estonia it’s the only thing keeping them from becoming just another oblast in Russia.

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>>4127485

>>4126748
>be country of 1-20 million people in Eastern Europe
>entire national history is defined by various transgressions by Germany, Russia, and/or Turkey
>some NATards show up and they kinda speak like fags but they offer a bright future in exchange for a bit of sovereignty
>first time in your nation's history two consecutive generations have lived in anything approaching comfort and stability
I wonder why.

>>4113970
>This transnational political organization of humanist values, parliamentary democracy, and incremental progress through technocratic governance is Le Evil because...???
Because every single one of these these things you listed are a sin against humanity itself. In fact I would even say these things are evil. For example, spartans had no problem with getting rid of the dysgenic genetic refuse in their societies, while moderns can't help but bend over backwards to appease every single immunocompromised mutant that wouldn't survive without modern medical intervention. While we may consider these societies to be brutal and unfair, in the long run they have a happier and more vital populace that are able to enjoy life instead of needing to contaminate the world with their slave morality.

>>4127208
>spartans had no problem with getting rid of the dysgenic genetic refuse
>people unironically believe the meme history of the Spartans
lol
Gonna cite 300 next?

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>>4127504 >>4127575 >>4127794 >>4140973

The Moralintern hiding things like contigency spreads, their containment of Pale and how Dolores Dei was actually some kind of inhuman monstrosity behind boring technocratic liberalism makes everything about them the most interesting parts of DE. Shame it'll never be expanded on.

>>4127176
>and/or Turkey
Wait, what have the Turks ever done to Estonia?

>>4127208
Sparta is a bad example to use. Their society was retarded and inflexible and declined because they refused to adapt to changing circumstances and by the time of Alexander the Great they were treated as a joke.

>>4127485
yeah i really wanted to pick up the estonian book that created the universe DE is set in for more crumbs of world lore but they never fucking translated it into english. i don't understand why.
the witchman books were translated into english when the games blew up
the book expedition 33 was loosely inspired by just got translated into english after the game blew up
why the fuck didn't this book get a translation. i know the devs imploded but the translation of the book wasn't up to them was it?

>>4127208
>is Le Evil because... They just are, OK???

>>4127504
Pretty sure that the reason it never got an official translation is that there's still a copyright dispute over who owns the world of Elysium, so neither ZAUM or Kurvitz are willing to touch it. There's fanmade translations though, and some of them are even decent.

>>4127485
>by the time of Alexander the Great they were treated as a joke
The Macedonians were famously afraid to fight them, and they were the only Greeks they didn’t subjugate.
You’re thinking of a few hundred years later, with Rome.

>>4127208
18 year old anon reads a Nietzsche summary and lets it consume his personality. A terrible thing to see.

>>4127485
>Wait, what have the Turks ever done to Estonia?
Making more of a broad point about Central-East European countries, rather than Estonia specifically.

>>4113014
>fear of taking a stand.
this is how i know you did not play the game

>>4113970
The moralintern is primarily concerned with culturally erasing the populations that are under its jurisdiction. It is quite literally a stand-in for modern globohomo. Their goal is to abolish indigenous cultural identities and sterilize the populace. They make the limbo-like rot of Martinaise infinitely worse because they're not there to rebuild, but to keep the people down.

>>4128456
and this information is where, in the game?

>>4127990
I played the game back when there wasn’t even a voiceover for most of the dialogue. I am an RPG connaisseur, and I am always years ahead of trends. By the time you subhuman insects catch up, games can only be enjoyed ironically.

What stand did this game take, as evidenced by the game itself? You likely think it’s “woke”, because you read so on twitter. Or because the developers turned out to hate Trump, or whatever the fuck. You’re unable to look at a piece of art and judge it with your own eyes and brain.

Cofnas is correct. The right wing is just a collection of medieval peasants with smartphones. You should leave the thinking to smarter men, like me, and just repeat my opinions.

>>4128466
Dialogue with the Sunday Friend is the most illuminating on this, but it can be difficult to gather because there's a very narrow window when you can ask him about Moranintern goals and Kim has to be absent during this exchange. But yeah, they view indigenous cultures in itself as undesirable and encourage homosexuality for the purpose of destroying family units.

>>4128467
Game by communists
The devs stance is quite blatant
Very dumb, you are

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>>4128882

>>4128522
The game is by communists but also communists who are deeply demoralized by the fall of the USSR and clearly see further attempts at communism to be futile.

>>4128467
>Tell the Deserter you're a fascist/moralist
>He tells you you're nothing but a meat shield the real fascists hide behind
>Tell the Deserter you're a nationalist or that you don't care about politics
>He calls you a lumpenprole
>Tell the Deserter you're a communist
>He tells you all the real communists are dead and you're just a poser
Plus
>The Deserter is the last real communist and he's a senile old man who only survived by cowardice
>>4128879
You can really tell the game was made by disaffected former Soviet bloc nationals.

>>4126184
So many words to say so little

>>4128882
You seem to be missing the point.

>>4136191
>>4136280
blowhard

Is Kim the worst straight man/party member in RPG history? He just lets you drug around and fuck things up, never tells you no, or anything. I actually don't understand why he's in the game, there's no combat for him to help in and he doesn't provide any party bonuses. He's not even funny or entertaining.

I did not walk away from that game thinking about ideology. It surprised me so many people did, and I avoided the game because so many people said it was for communist lovers. I don't think the game really had anything profound to say about Capitalism vs Marxism. I understand the game presented the ideological conflict between fascists, capitalists, and communists, but I never saw the game pushing an agenda with consequences for choosing a side. I thought it was surprisingly neutral allowing you to explore the paths but question them. >>4114921 this is the lesson I walked away from more than anything. Also failure and misery is part of being human and redemption is possible regarding being the main character's story.
>>4136601
Kim is the grounding rod who keeps the main character connected to reality. He has a lot of patience which is how he can tolerate the bad partnership and allows the main character to fuck things up. He is not supposed to be a wild card nor take complete control of the situation. He is actually very important to how the game works.

It was barely a game with a small amount of content. The only reason it generates discussion is it was a libtarded game that didn’t flop.

This game is utterly insufferable if you've ever read one (1) book in your entire life

>>4138964
I think a lot of people who discuss it online come from cultures where it is less socially acceptable to openly discuss politics, especially extreme politics. So a game set in a shithole, where people naturally have strong opinions about what made things shit, becomes “a game/story about politics” instead of a story about being a person in a shithole.
>>4139608
Idk I read plenty and found the writing very enjoyable. What was so insufferable?

>>4112908
Isn't this the "game" with no combat?

>>4140222
>What was so insufferable?
The language is completely front-loaded and vapid. It all sounds like a long reddit post. Read one chapter of Moby Dick or Ulysses and you'll never waste your time on that drivel again.

>>4127236
>>4127485
>>4127515
>>4127610
Kek

Don't care about your pilpuling, you are the bleached mestizo of European yoke. In every sense you are browner and swarthier than your predecessors.

>>4140973
I get that you're trying to emulate your right wing posting heroes but this is retarded and doesn't make any sense.

i stopped playing this when they bleeped out the word faggot. game made by a bunch if pussies

>>4141047
What a thin-skinned faggot you are.

>>4141047
Not even the word faggot
They bleeped out their fake version of faggot they made up

>>4141240
it broke my immersion

>>4141283
Real chads love self censorship in the face of Big Homo.

>>4141296
the fuck is taht supposed to mean

>>4140336
>its not going to be remembered as a top 10 work in the english language
Yeah, probably not. Is there anything concrete you take issue with other than that?

>>4141431
>Is there anything concrete you take issue with other than that?
It doesn't need to be a top 10 work in the English language. It could be "good enough". The problem is it desperately tries to be "more" when it has no right to.

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>>4126748
>everybody secretly agrees with me they're just too scared to admit it

>>4141484
Care to substantiate your argument?

>>4114927
>at least there aren't firing squads and genocides
Moralintern factually canonicaly bombed most of Revachol into rubble, killing more people in 10 minutes than old King or Commune did over decades.

>>4116085
Klaasje is a nasty person, but really all the bad shit she did was against awful motherfuckers for the benefit if other awful motherfuckers. Lely was an absolute shitstain of a human, and it reflects awfully on Klaasje that he's the guy she managed to form an intimate understanding with. Ultimately, you don't save or protect anyone by getting ger arrested, you merely help some gigakikes even out their accounts of gigakikery, so mostly it boils down to how personally slighted you feel by her manipulation efforts. Though e could argue that someone who lies Big Time as naturally as she breathes only makes any place she's in worse, but then she just immediately fucks off if you let her. I prefer letting her go purely to spite the Oranje gigakikes.

Ruby is fucking personally responsible for flooding Revachol with drugs, bullet through the cranium is unironically too good for her.

>>4140336
I would suggest you read one (1) book beyond your high school cirriculum

>>4113970
>Le Evil because...
...it bombs places to shit, turns their populace into cattle and literally actually fucks them in the ass. It's fucking Rome, man.

>>4142052
>it reflects awfully on Klaasje that he's the guy she managed to form an intimate understanding with
They are countrymen, it makes sense that they would.

>>4142061
>It's fucking Rome, man.
Wtf, I love the Moralintern now!

>>4142140
Actual homosexual pederasty desu

>>4142139
Not really, seeing how different their backgrounds are. You might as well argue that Joyce and Rene could easily find common ground.

>>4142177
1) Klaasje is a woman so ofc she’d like the murder and rape chad regardless of her politics, and 2) people pair up weirdly when surrounded by foreigners… people of different politics are often more similar than people of different nation.

>>4142522
>Klaasje is a woman so ofc she’d like the murder and rape chad regardless of her politics, and
Lely was not a chad though. He was a sad, unloved, punked loser all his life. Treated like refuse since the day he was born. That's what actually got Klaasje - she saw in him someone she recognized as fucked by life to the same degree as ger, and was enamoured with how he managed to cope. By taking out his abuse on others, that is. She fell in love with the ugly ideal of what she wanted to be in her situation - someone who fights back when hurt. And so when the world once again conspired against her, she fought back, with the means she knew.

>>4142534
Only a tranny would provide such a detailed analysis. Lely was a supersoldier Chad, with friends that were ready to kill and die for him, and Klaasje was a Dutch BPD slut, carefully inserted in the game to tug on the heartstrings of autistic players.

The only memorable thing about this mid-ass game is Klaasje counting the stars tattooed on Lely, need me a girl like that.

>>4142983
You seem convinced that it takes a trooning to gain a modicum of analytical capability, namenigger. Might be projection.
>Lely was a supersoldier Chad
Supersoldier Chads are born to High Command dads, spend their adolescence deflowering heiresses and are currently chilling on the battleship with their epaulets, cold champagne and expensive escorts, ready to turn the entire Revachol along with Krenel and other shabesgoyim into subatomic dust at a moment's notice. Chad's don't get dumped by their parents in a leaf compacter to only be snatched from the sweet embrace of death into foster care hell with 3 alcoholic stepdads and 5 pedo uncles a year, concluding in promotion to overseas canon fodder, with the rest of it's days distributed between shoving around loincloth while neck-deep in shit and trying to kill itself with opiate overdoses - but a randomn schizo's bullet gets there first, as usual.

>friends ready to kill and die for him
Where were said friends when he actually got wasted? Did they ever put in a pittance of effort into punishing Lely's actual killer? Have they mustered enough respect for Lely to at least stay sober until he's avenged?

Of all the characteristics and estimates of people and organisations in DE's world, Krenel being the unfathomable jobber shitstains is the single.most objective and undisputed one. Not only they managed to lose their comander in a ruined, emasculated and DISARMED loincloth shithole - they then proceeded to nig out at nothing and somehow mass suicide by two hobocops with bore-loaders, ALL WHILE WEARING BULLETPROOF ARMOR. There exist no /d/ RPGmaker games that depict a rape of even remotely similar proportions.

>>4142983
>Klaasje was a Dutch BPD slut, carefully inserted in the game to tug on the heartstrings
She's the most hated character in the entire game. Maybe only Sunday Friend is more hated.
>Only a tranny would provide such a detailed analysis
90IQ statement.
>>4142534
>>4143148
Depends on your definition of "chad". You can be chad in a handsome nobleman way or in a trailer trash way and everywhere in between. Mercenaries from Western Europe in the 20th Century weren't exactly bottom rung people on the social ladder, even if they spent their lives living like animals in third world hellscapes. The BPD foid saw it as cool at least, like you said
>She fell in love with the ugly ideal of what she wanted to be in her situation
She sees the rapechad and goes "giwtwm". Mentally unstable foids and career grunts go together perfectly.

>>4143325
>She's the most hated character in the entire game.
Nah, Ruby is substantially worse in every conceivable way.

>You can be chad in a handsome nobleman way or in a trailer trash way and everywhere in between.
True, but Lely is not a chad in any way. His life consisted of abuse and suffering all the way through, and he never rose above it to take control of his fate - he merely found ways to cope, by repaying the violence he is subjected with more violence of his own. He was a trapped animal that started seeing it's cage as a home. Measurehead, Joyce, Evrart or Iago are chads - regardless of their situation, they recognize their capacity for choice and choose to be free, exerting control over themselves and world around them, expressing their will and being themselves, actors of their fates instead of victims.

>Mercenaries from Western Europe in the 20th Century weren't exactly bottom rung people on the social ladder
Akshually the overwhelming majority of them were. PMC is a career very poorly suited for well-established and adjusted people pursuing reasonable goals. People who join in order to make cash know that they are doing so by putting their health and life at a stake, so it's not a very solid way to make money. People who join to fight for ideals realize that their service is ultimately subject to pay, not said ideals - mercs get bought, sold, and ultimately work for the highest bidder, not the rightest one. You need a combination of an adventure seeker doing it for the experience and thrill, a man who is okay with killing other people in process, and simultaneously not a psychopath. Such people factually existed, but were exceedingly rare. Most men serving under Schramme, McAleese or Prygozhin were utter motherfuckers.

>>4143325
>She sees the rapechad and goes "giwtwm"
In a way, yeah. The important parts here are:
1. It explains why Klaasje took a turn from her normal survival strategy - cry and run away - to a more proactive solution in the form of staged lynching. Note that after that ended in a disaster, she reverted to her old modus operandi: run and don't look back.
2. It brilliantly illustrates the exact way bad situations and company make people worse - Klaasje is in a bad spot, and in seeking a way out she begins to admire and imitate the worst qualities of a man she knows who seemingly fares better in a similarly bad situation.

Absolute kino desu.