Did the Dreamcast even compete against the ps2/gamecube/Xbox? It seems like it was sold as an alternative to the ps1 and n64 rather than any gen 6 console. Dreamcast is gen 5
Bernie Stolar could have saved the Dreamcast
It was the canary in the coal mine of gen 6
>>12900361Nah it was in this weird middle ground where it was competing and sharing third party games with the PS1, by the time the PS2 actually came out it was already dead.
In my personal XP, I only knew a couple people that had one during the heyday(same with the cube). I would not consider it on the same level as ps2 at all. The ps2 was everywhere and it was around the time vidya was becoming less of a nerd hobby that was looked down on and more of a widespread fun party type activity. We don't need to keep having useless console war discussions over and over again.
>>12900380Yeah, basically this. The Dreamcast launched in Japan in fall of 1998, which was when the fifth gen consoles were in their prime. It was launching against Metal Gear Solid and OoT.
>>12900361>Did the Dreamcast even compete against the ps2/gamecube/Xbox? No, not really, no. It was competing against the PSX and then the PS2 came out and the DC died in 2 months.
>>12900361>XboxPlease jump from a bridge
>>12900361No matter how you slice it, sega is retarded for releasing a 5th gen system like one year from the end of the generation's life cycle OR releasing a 6th gen system in an uncompetitive state it couldn't keep up
>>12900408That’s what happened with the Wii U as well. It was a weird Frankensteined together half step up console. Then the PS4/Xbone launched a year later.
>>12900412not retro
>>12900408I mean for one thing there was no such thing as "generation cycles" up to that point; secondly releasing the megadrive 2 years before the SNES is how Sega became known
>>12900416Basically they tried to do the genesis strategy again without giving America any good games to use or their marketing
>>12900416Super Nintendo was about 2 years late, at least in Japan it was. That is why PC Engine took off against the Famicom.
>>12900434I mean the N64 also came out 2 years after the PSX and Saturnit's almost like there was no clear "generation cycle" cut-off point and everyone was doing their thing again and again, damn
>>12900413Neither is Ps2.
>>12900458N64 was famously late do to development struggles it was intended to be out world wide in 1995. Famicom was released in 1983 and was showing it age badly by 1988 but Nintendo sat on their hands until NEC was starting to be a real threat. SNEs 1991 was fine because NES came out a couple years later but in the homeland it was late to the game and did cost some sales. The point is Sega was ran by morons and managed to piss everyone off with Saturn and Dreamcast. North America Saturn was too early and botched so no one bought it, In Japan Dreamcast killed Saturn too early so Japanese didn't buy Dreamcast.
>>12900412I notice you skipped the Wii, which absolutely dominated its generation despite having "weak" hardware. Hardware specs have never mattered. The Dreamcast shit all over its competition during its effective lifespan and nobody bought it. It didn't die because it was weaker than consoles which released when Sega was already closing in on bankruptcy and had to call it quits.
>>12900959Well, the Wii and PlayStation 3 launched at roughly the same time. The 360 was the one that felt early since the Xbox had only been on the market since 2001.
>>12900361I say it competed with the N64 mostly. I guess the PS1 too. From 99 to the PS2 release. Obviously PS1 was the market leader, but it was also the old console at the time that was obviously not as good as the others in many ways. But by then PS1 had a huge install base. Of course, Nintendo fucking up and using cartridges meant both disc systems would always be better than N64 in some other ways. And the Dreamcast not having two joysticks meant the PS1 had something up on it too. Dreamcast had the graphics and online play, PS1 had twin sticks and install base and just a larger quantity of games.The PS1 conpeted with the Dreamcast Kind of like the SNES (and even the Genesis kinda) lasted all the way up until the middle of 96 while getting beaten hardware-wise by the ps1 and nobody was buying Sega’s new stuff. If a console is successful it has a long life. Sometimes lasting “1.5 generations” If it doesn’t sell well, the company has to scramble and get something else out fast and sometimes it only lasts half of a generation. The NES sold well, so it competed with the Turbografx-16 and Genesis for a bit. Stuff like the Jaguar, 3DO and Saturn sold like shit, so they didn’t stay on the market as long. If you call the 32x a console, it would be an extreme case. Also the Virtual Boy.A consequence of this is stuff like the NES, Genesis, SNES and PS1 stayed on the market forever, so developers really had time to push them to their maximum and we really got to see what they could do. With the Saturn (especially with it being hard to program for), it probably died without us seeing it pushed to its limit as much as it could have been.
>>12900361Any good JRPGs on Dreamcast?
>>12900361No, it competed against the N64 and PS1. Console was already discontinued by the time Xbox/GC came out. The moment the PS2 came out, it was already over for the system and they kneeled quickly. I really think Sega could've performed better as a major third party publisher had they left the console business after the Saturn.
>>12900361Dreamcast was definitely 6th gen. Only haters call it 5 gen.>>12900367No he couldn't, he killed the Sega Saturn and abandoned the Dreamcast. Later on Dreamcast would be murdered by piracy. So even if he had stayed, piracy would still kill the Dreamcast.
>>12901315It's gen 5.5, at best. Get over it. Much of its library was shared with the PSX and Windows 98. It's practically what the Saturn should've been, and the reason why it's dead is plain simple: Sega was ran by a bunch of fuckheads. You fucking Segafags disgust me.
>>12900361>competeDoesn’t matter. That’s not how anybody determines what gen a console belongs to. Also Dreamcast got games up through 2007.
>>12901348False. It's gen 6, especially with games like Shenmue, Sonic Adventure, Jet Grind Radio, Crazy Taxi, Dead Or Alive 2 and Soul Calibur, which would have been impossible on a fifth gen console. Also Dead Or Alive 2 looks better on Dreamcast than the PS2 version. Stay triggered Sonycuck.
>>12901315A Gen 6 console competing against Gen 5 consoles with Gen 5 sensibilities and some cutting edge ideas that were more fleshed out with systems like the Xbox. They just didn't have the money or resources to sustain a console and hardware was evolving so rapidly in that era that it couldn't keep up without the intention of releasing a ton of peripherals (two analog sticks for one) or a new media storage to compensate bigger games.
>>12901390Honestly the controller didn't need an extra stick and it certainly didn't need more storage, that's what multiple discs are for. However any 5 gen games Dreamcast had(such as Spider-man), looked and played better on Dreamcast and is on par with the PC version.
>>12901381It couldn't even last until XP was released. All the fifth gen titles stopped around the first two years of the new millennium, and Sega had to port their first party titles to their former competitors, just trying to stay alive after fucking around in the 90s.>Wow, that Playstation game is running at 480 resolution and 60 FPS on Dreamcast. Take that, Sony!
>>12901428These people have been mindbroken for a quarter of a century. It really is sad.
Privacy Killed The Dreamcast
>>12901381Compare Sonic Adventure, Banjo-Kazooie, and Jak and Daxter. Adventure is more 5th gen.
>>12903056i first played sa:dx on the gamecube as a kid and noticed it felt a little different, but not as different as a gen v game. sa2b feels like a regular gen vi game
>>129014285th gen consoles can't run the games I mentioned. You're basically grasping at straws.>>12903041Actually Privacy killed the spycams.>>12903056I've played those games, Sonic Adventure is way more advance and fluid unlike Banjo Kazooie. It also looks better than either of those two games.
>>12901315>No he couldn't, he killed the Sega Saturn and abandoned the Dreamcast.Sega of Japan killed the Saturn, and told Bernie to kill it as well.Bernie then SAVED the Dreamcast by fighting Sega of Japan to have the console built-in, and announced it for $200 (when japan wanted it to cost $250).
>>12901381>Soul Calibur, which would have been impossible on a fifth gen console.Soul Calibur originally ran on a fifth gen console hardware with extra memory.
>>12903304Nothing is changing the fact the Dreamcast failed hard, and Sega fucked up. Doesn't matter how neat the textures looked. It barely competed with the PS2, and was already dead by the time the Gamecube came out. If anything, the Xbox did everything it did, but a bit better and having a bigger company to back it.
Sega's ability to shoot their wad too early is certainly something
>>12903329>but a bit betterFar better. Built in hard drive, a far beefier internal hardware, cable (no dial up) only online, a controller that mirrored the amount of Playstation 2's inputs but with asymmetrical positioning for the joysticks making it better for FPS's.What the Dreamcast had over the Xbox was a better dpad and it could include keyboard/mouse options, even if the latter wasn't fully realized.
>>12903315This> Released in 1998, the arcade cabinet ran on the Namco System 12 board. This hardware was an overclocked, upgraded architecture based directly on the Sony PlayStation 1—making its core internal tech part of the fifth generation.
>>12900361not really i didn't know anyone who had one even when they went on discount
>>12900383First time I'm hearing this context.
>>12903502Doesn't matter. Genesis launched in 1988 in Japan and still ate the SNES's lunch when it debuted three years later. Dreamcast mogged PSX/N64 because they weren't the same generation.
>>12903586*debuted in America three years later
>>12903586>>12903590The Genesis launched in North America in 1989.
>>12903595And SNES was fall 1990 in JP, summer 1991 in NA.
>>12903312>Bernie SAVED the DreamcastNo he didn't. He killed the Sega Saturn and abandoned the Dreamcast before it even launched in the U.S. and eventually let it die by the hands of piracy.>>12903315Fifth gen consoles aren't capable of producing arcade style graphics. Dreamcast delivered on making an arcade perfect port.>>12903329Dreamcast only failed because piracy killed it.
>>12903617I don’t buy this argument because what games did the Dreamcast have to offer in 2001 and beyond? Remember that Jet Set Radio Future and Panzer Dragoon Orta wouldn’t have looked nearly as good as they did on Xbox. Dreamcast graphics would’ve kept looking more and more outdated in an alternate reality with no piracy.
>>12903628Also: the Dreamcast’s ability to produce arcade ports wasn’t special anymore once all the other consoles could as well. imo SoulCalibur 2 represented the end of the Dreamcast’s relevance.
>>12903595The point is that it was an old-ass system when SNES showed up but nobody today pretends the Genesis wasn't from that generation.
>>12903646Well, the interesting thing about 16-bit consoles was the ability to add chips to the game cartridges which allowed games to do things that the base hardware wasn’t designed to do, which allowed the SNES to stay relevant. In Sega’s case they released add-ons for the Genesis to expand its capabilities.
Dreamcast is a console made just to play Shenmue
>>12903657And even then Shenmue II got a superior Xbox version.
>>12903657Dreamcast was made so I can play superior versions of Silver and Jedi Power Battles.
>>12903680Silver was pretty cool with some flaws. Wish there had been more RPGs like it. Loved the art design.
>>12903617>He killed the Sega SaturnJapan killed the Saturn. They were planning on new consoles as early as 1995 with Nvidia and 3dfx. Bernie was told to prepare the grounds for their next machine, which meant telling every dev and retailer to drop the Saturn in favor of their next machine.>and abandoned the Dreamcast before it even launched in the U.S. and eventually let it die by the hands of piracy.Bernie was responsible for the DC launching as well as it did, because he talked Japan into making the modem be in all units instead of acting as an additional upgrade, which made SegaNet possible. Also US units had 56k modems instead of the 33k ones in Japan.He also dropped the price to $200 instead of the $250 that Japan wanted to sell it for, which is probably the reason he was replaced by Peter Moore - he was no longer playing ball.You can blame Bernie all you want but it was Sega of Japans retardation that was ultimately responsible.
>>12903617>Fifth gen consoles aren't capable of producing arcade style graphics.Several arcade machines used fifth gen console hardware inside them. Namco System 11/12, Sega ST-V, Konami System 573, Taito FX-1A/B, I think the G-Net too, Sony ZN-1/2...
>>12903617Again with the fucking piracy spiel. It was its only saving grace to get more people buying. Sega's first party titles didn't have the same momentum like Nintendo's, and much of the third party was already on PSX, PC, and arcades. The fact they couldn't even try to get Saturn backwards compatibility was probably wasted potential.
>>12904942Why would they try to get backwards compatibility for a system nobody bought? It's up in the air whether the Saturn even existed at all. Nobody even saw them in the wild when they were brand new, and even today there are only a handful of games out there that presumably will play on this "system" that nobody owns.
>>12903718the only ones i know are the taiko no tatsujin games and they are 2d as hell
Privacy killed the Dreamcast. Microsoft knew that which is why they came up with Kinect.
>>12904942Piracy Killed The Dreamcast, that's the truth you dodge, your bargain bin habits hit harder than sabotage! You called it preserving, but you never paid the cost. Every disc you burn is another sale lost.
>>12901297About the only ones that come to mind are Skies of Arcadia, the Evolution games and Grandia 2.You could maybe include more action-based dungeon crawlers like PSO and Record of Lodoss War, but that's a stretch.
>>12900384>PSXYou mean PS1.PSX nickname was never approved by Sony Japan.
>>12900361The Sonic hype had kinda died down, and that was what carried Sega through the 90's. I personally had moved on from the Genesis to the N64, and never looked back. My parents somehow arranged to have a guy come to our house and buy my Sega collection pre-Marketplace. Maybe it was a newspaper ad. The guy bought it all for a song.When we were console gaming we were playing Mario 64, Golden Eye, Mario Kart 64, Smash Bros, Diddy Kong Racing. Didn't have money for much else. Rich kid down the street had PS1 and reams of games. Everyone else had N64's. And oh yeah, online PC Gaming started taking off amongst the suburban youth around this time. Dreamcast was kinda DOA. Maybe some proto-weeb nerd at school showed interest, but I can't recall if they actually bought it.We were PC gamers from that point on. RPGs like Baldur's Gate, Sim City and Civ 2, Half-life and it's myriad of (free) mods like Counter-strike and Team Fortress. RTS like Red Alert, Age of Empires 2, Warcraft 2, Starcraft. MMOs like Ultima Online and Everquest. It'd take consoles several years to catch up, and even then XBOX only ever made it out of the gate because of Halo.
>>12905696>fifth element
>>12905662Strange how piracy killed Dreamcast but saved PlayStation 2.
>>12906232Piracy wasn't widespread on the PS2, since a modchip was required. The many Greatest Hits titles available is proof that piracy couldn't cause a dent in video game sales, thus allowing the PS2 to be super successful.
>>12906290It was super easy and everyone had one.
>>12906301That's a delusional take that has no basis in reality.
>>12906316You couldn't find a unmodded used PS2 back in the day.
>>12906319Funny because I repair and refurbish PS2 consoles for my game store and none of them were modded.
>SpicStation 2>piracy not widespreadAHAHAHAHAHA WHAT A FUCKING CLOWN
>>12903502YOU HEAR THAT EVERYONE? THIS ANON NEVER HEARD OF THIS BEFORE, THAT MEANS ITS TOTALLY UNTRUE! BACK TO THE DRAWING BOARD EVERYBODY! HE NEVER HEARD OF IT! THAT MEANS ITS NOT TRUE!!!
>>12900361The Dreamcast just kinda existed in it's own small little window of relevance where it was like the coolest thing for maybe a year and then it quickly began facing away. It was already dying by the time the PS2 arrived and barely competed with it at all
>>12906335I bought and sold on Craigslist and I couldn't find any unmodded.
>>12906410That's because piracy killed the Dreamcast.
>>12906445I'll take "Things That Never Happened" for $500 Alex.
