Why did Ash worked but Liko & Roy didn't?
>>59685514He’s not coming back
>>59685514Ash stopped working after Gen 4
>>59685534Mindless repetition in lieu of a point. Kek. Bodied yourself.
>>59685538Gen 2, you're part of the problem.>>59685514Ash came out at around the same time the franchise did.
>>59685514>anime makes changes because the company got sick of the same formula>new character doesn't do anything to improve the show
>>59685550Ash was supposed to be swapes out after winning the orange league. The thunde special was supposed to be a promo for the new era of the anime, but game freak got angry and wouldn’t allow the anime people to do so.
>>59685514Dang, why is this back again?! If it makes you fell better liko and Roy will be gone by the time winds and waves comes out, but it’s a kids TV show, it’s really not that deep, would you have watched ash for 50+ years, the answer is no
>>59685514The ashnime was already dwindling in viewership since BW. It's just animated fanfic now. It no longer has the staying presence in the IP it used to in the early gens.
>>59685557He'll never come back.>>59685567>If it makes you fell better liko and Roy will be gone by the time winds and waves comes outExcept the problem aren't Liko nor Roy.>would you have watched ash for 50+ years, the answer is noYou're kidding right?
Ash's character was completely ruined in gen 2 onwards making him a boring ageless self insert for the audience when that obviously wasn't the case in earlier episodes. He only "Worked" because of the loose idea that he *was* that scrappy little boy
Liko is hot but they made her design slightly less hot later so the rating declined
>>59685514HE'S NEVER COMING BACK
>>59685534> Naruto getting new special episodes > Kishimoto announce a new Naruto manga call Naruto Shadow Rising. ITS OVER Naruto tried to replace their icon with Boruto but the series fall apart after Naruto got sealed to the point Kishimoto disowned the series by calling it his assistant's work. The only example you had of a long running series replacing their iconic original protagonist after more than 10 years decided to bring back their original protagonist instead of carry on with a new one. There is also rumor floating over new YUGIOH remake with Yugi & Atem. If Pokemon anime tries to bring another OC as the main protagonist after the failure of Alain, Goh, Liko and Roy than there is no hope left for the series.
>>59685514I've seen this video. This video isn't even about Ash being gone, it's because the new show has shit distribution worldwide and they've already finished the main arc but the new game hasn't come yet so now it's just boring filler until the new game comes out
>>59685538Based and Truthpilled
>>59685514Here's the vid itselfhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ArSPi87kzUIBeyond 2:30, he talks about other issues affecting the show's viewership beyond "Ash being gone"
>>59685514Well, Liko is a foid and Roy is a nigger
>>59685514actual answer: japans birth rate is cratering
>>59685601they announced a new movie without ash lol, pkmn is a videogame , they dont care the tranime anymore
>Cartoon Network Latam is brining back pokemon to the channel, but instead of Horizons it's JourneysLikoflop
>>59685594>slightly less hot = older than 10 years old for pedofagTypical Horizons enjoyer
since they removed ash the sales increased lol
>>59685538>>59685550Ash & TRio worked fine till all eight generation, the actual problem were the new OC after Gen 04 that the show tried to shove on people. Pokemon Journey would have been better with more screentime on Marnie and Bede instead of wasting episode after episode on Koharu and Eevee journey to find their dream.
>>59685640And people already hates it.
>>59685658they really dont care the anime, it makes no money compared vidoegames, merch and tcg
>>59685658Rica Matsumoto was stealing money from them; I’m not surprised.
>>59685538Ash should have been taken out back with a shotgun after the Johto series
A sequels to XY&Z where Ash travels with Brock & Serena to find a way to erase the remaining Dark Vines would have more interesting than the entire main story of Horizons. Especially if Serena gets a new hairstyle with even bustier figure and a new personality to develop a natural chemistry with Ash who reverts back to his OS-DP personality.Because people give more dam about Amourshipping than the entire story revolving Rakulium, Liko & Amethio's magic bloodline, Roy's goal to catch Rayquaza and Navi's wanting a dream.
because digimon is better
>>59685514While 90% of the Ashnime episodes were random character of the week, at least it showed all the characters from the game and even fleshing out some of them. Horizons is 100% focusing on their OCs nobody cares about and ignoring popular characters like Kieran.
>>59685514liko works for my dickthe gook and indian do not
its not only liko the problem, nupokemon is fucking dogshit , new pokemon are ugly shit, new character designs look like troons, the art is bad and cheap etc..except jouneys is when everything went to shit
>>59685715*ash had luck exceot journeys
>>59685514Nostalgiatards remembering the ashnime as better than it was. As soon as the source of their nostalgia left, they saw the anime for what it always was: boring, formulaic monster of the week dogshit with bad writing, flat characters, and ugly visuals.
>>59685601You say that when Digimon had their remake, people shit on it.
>>59685715
>>59685575It's always been "dwindling in viewership". DP performed worse than AG too, and AG performed worse than OS. Live television viewing in general has dropped all over the line.
>>59685658Frankly the very existence of the anime has been pointless for years, decades even. They should have stuck to miniseries like Paldean Winds etcWhy they keep doing it, who knows.HZ was alright but it needed to be really kino to make an impact and fell short. Still better than anything the ashnime vomited post Shudo>>59685702retardkun, ash is an OC
>>59685538/thread
>>59686015Ash is the protagonist of Red and Green. He's an anime counterpart, sure, but that's no different from Brock and Misty. Official localization documents for Red & Blue very explicitly refer to the protagonist and rival from the games as Satoshi and Shigeru.
>>59685972Yeah, I'm not implying that it was solely because of BW or the staff's direction. I just think BW was probably the point where it took a fatalistic turn.
>>59685665no, they fundamentally didnt work after johto.and that's being generous with TR
>>59685702>i suddenly care about game characters
>>59686060>no, they fundamentally didnt work after johto.It worked just fine . Only bunch of oversmart moron complain over it because everything has to be deep serious and edgy with them.
Not black, not a woman
>>59686082I was already fed up with TR even while I was watching as a kid. Revisiting the series didn't make them more tolerable. They had their charming moments but they worked best from the sidelines.
>>59686090Pokémon wasn't about TR, it was about Ash's journey throughout the Pokémon world. TRio were basically the Dr Doofenshmirtz of pokémon anime.
>>59685514The exact opposite is true. Ash didn't work at all, the anime tanked more and more the longer they stuck with him and had become cuturally irrelevant outside of literal toddlers and a few weirdo Ash self-inserters by the time he was finally retired. Liko, on the other hand, has worked quite well.
>>59686090TR were fun characters wasted on the most bland repetitive pastiche of the Doronbo Gang because all the oxygen in the show was being hogged by the worst protagonist in the history of fiction. James should have been the MC of the anime and Ash should have never existed.
Boys (the main audience) don't want a girl MC
>>59685514Ash barely worked. XY hit the retarded shipping fags like crack but actual interest in the anime was steadily declining, especially in the movies. Horizons failed because they pussied out. Most of it was the same filler bullshit as the old anime, just without Ash to nostalgia wrangle 40 year old idiots. They had no confidence in actually writing a girl MC, so they gave Roy Ash's late-stage battle bot "characterization" and threw a Pikachu and shiny mega Lucario and Rayquaza his way to overcompensate.
>>59686028You can literally see in your own picture that the ratings have dropped steadily over the years with nothing particularly sticking out as a notable decline. Other shows have dropped in viewers the same way. Pokemon has always been TV Tokyo's most watched anime outside of I believe a short period where it got beaten by Naruto at the height of its popularity, and there's not a single anime on ANY channel that gets the kind of ratings today that Johto got in its day. This kind of rating comparison has always been retarded.
>>59686193Also, what retards don't get is that "lower ratings" does not mean "less people watch", but "less people sit in front of their TV and watch it during that half hour it's on".Back in the OS days there wasn't a whole lot of other ways to watch the series, these days it's on Youtube on like 4 different official channels immediately after the episode ends.
>Responses that aren't favoring OP's view on the hick are ESL, antagonizes posters over arguments, drag in non-Pokemon shows or all three combinedJust get a job Fagmon this is getting sad to watch.
No Team Rocket
>>59685702>Horizons is 100% focusing on their OCs nobody cares about and ignoring popular characters like Kieran.This is the biggest problem right here. The anime worked best when expanding on game characters and lore. Make a new anime based on the Gen 10 supporting cast and you might have something.
>>59686026Actually, if you played GSC or HGSS, you'd know that Red is the protagonist of RBGY and FRLG, not Ash."Official localization documents" aren't canon, the games themselves are.
>>59686090You got filtered which is to say you were a retarded child
>>59686188> Carried the series for 26 years without magic ancestor or special privileges > N-no Ash didn't work cause I said so.Its like insisting Goku & Nobita didn.t worked. Even SM series had same rating as Precure series. The rating took actual nosedive when JN series decided to have Ash travel with a boy OC instead of Gloria & Alister. Now to think of it, Pokemon rating dropped whenever they changed the formula staring with Best Wishes that removed Brock & made TRio serious.
>>59686694"Pokemon rating dropped" since practically day 1. >>59686028
>>59685594Pedofag spotted
>>59686694Doraemon's and Dragonball's ratings have dropped even harder than Pokemon's, lol
>>59686748Yep. I looked it up. Highest rated Dragonball episode ever: 29.5 (Jan 21 1987)Last week's episode: 2.8Highest rated Doraemon episode ever: 31.2 (Feb 11,1983)Last week's episode: 2.6Maybe Goku & Nobita don't work after all.
>>59686800B-b-but my narrative...
Pokemon: SHADOW RISING is coming faggots.
>>59685514Dragon Ball is airing again>>59685538Holy trvke
>>59686028Those xy ratings are fucking lie lmao it was even lower and mogged by yokai watch
>>59685658This is like when they stop making Yu-Gi-Oh a tot show and just did anime that explored lore with the cards instead.
>>59686949Yokai Watch is mogging Dragonball and Doraemon right now.
>>59686800>Last week's episode: 2.8>look up>it's a remake of BoG AGAINwhat the hell are people expecting?Even though DB is going to generate money again
>>59685567i watched this retard for about 30 and hes never disappointed so far. ash isnt as likeable but hes up there
>>59686960The same for tpc they stopped using ash and they are making , new protagonist, tcg anime etc..
>>59686971Poketoons too
>>59686965weird they actually did the first 2 episodes very well, like literally 100% improved in every way. then episode 3 was completely botched lol but it was a vegeta centered episode anyway that fuckin nerd ruins everything
>>59686562if you want to follow the games' story play the games
>>59685567>Dang, why is this back againbecause of that one schizo. New here?>would you have watched ash for 50+ years, the answer is noPretty sure this schizo in particular would
>>59686979you dont get one until gen 3 though. you have to actually explore gen 1 and 2. gen 3 kinda has this with the regi trio but its very convoluted and kinda defeats its own purpose
>>59686800They should replace Goku and Nobita with Liko expies.
>>59686988>you have to actually explore gen 1 and 2funny enough, that's actually the only time the ashnime was good. Afterwards it became redundant and shit
>>59686989Ignoring the series' shortcomings Liko is unironically sexo. In another era with more children watching TV, she'd be an iconic preteen awakening
>>59686800It got low ratings because they removed the humiliation ritual segments of Vegeta (it wasn't in the manga anyways)
>>59687000Wrong episode. Also these are viewer ratings, people don't travel back in time and unwatch episodes they don't like.
>>59687009It was because they didn't do the retarded "Beerus flicks SS4 Goku" meme, right?
>>59686991idk thats definitely a stretch. the more recent ashnime was actually really good, definitely outweighs the flaws. id say the same for the xy/z anime too. i didnt get the chance to sit down and watch black/white but id catch it on occasions waking up before work and it seemed like it actually fucking sucked. only knowledge i have of gen 3 is from the movies so i cant say much to that atm
>>59687000there wasnt a manga originally and the removal of the humiliation ritual was 100% a good thing. it was the lack of the slap and vegetas powerup being way less dramatic that actually fucked up the episode. the humor otherwise was done very well but they ruined the action segments. its cool ultra ego got a little bit of a reveal though i think.
>>59685538thisgen 4 was the peak of pokemon and everything after has been disappointing since, even in gamesin the anime, they paired him with extremely boring companions and even made team rocket cringe and lamei didn't even bother watching anything after seeing how boring the bw series is
>>59687022The numbers show how many people people watched the episode live on TV, not how many people watched the episode and then said "that was good", you dumbass. Nobody knows what specific bullshit gets kept or skipped until they've already watched it and been counted as viewers.
>>59685601The Boruto Manga is pretty good, and they did a good job of sealing away all thr competent characters (and having them lose some of their special powers so they could be sealed away) so that the new characters have to solve the problem themselves.I've heard the anime is an absolute clusterfuck of awful filler and fan service, but the manga has been enjoyable.
>>59686748>>59686800Still higher than Pokemon Horizon & Boruto ever did.If anything , rating dropped for all anime with highest being Sazae-san with only 7.3 and Detective Conan 5.2. None of change protagonist. While there is no mention of Precure in the ranking, all the anime in the top 10 ranking kept their original protagonist. Maybe Pokemon 2023 would still be in the ranking if Ash was travelling across Paldea with Arven & Juliana.
everything that Horizons shills gets killed. Pokemon Go is next
>>59687125hope they shill trading cards nexthate that shit
>>59686015>ash is an OCAs much of an OC as Gary. He's still based on Red as much as the Adventures character is. Liko isn't based on Juliana in the slightest nor is Roy based on any game character.
>>59687125The episodes get made six months in advance, Horizons literally had nothing to do with it. >[1].jpg
>>59687125more like nupokemon is garbage and ded
>>59686991It was trash back then too. Even as a kid I had to tap out at some point during the Orange Islands because I could tell how dogshit it was always going to be.
>>59686581Sure cause nothing's more stimulating than repetitive episodes and conflict resolutions that add nothing more than unnecessary paddling and the same five jokes for nearly 1,200 episodes. I was retarded for watching through it though
>>59685514Timeless shonen protagonist vs current year tumblr slop characters and designs, simple as
>>59687168Pokemon is a zombie franchise much like the Simpsons nowadays and it baffles me more people don't realize it.
>>59685640> A TCG movie where all pokemon are imaginary and inside people's head when they duel on a table and the entire movie will be less about pokemon and more about some teen drama. VS > A movie in the canon main Ashime timeline where Ash actually catches and bonds with a Zeraora and pass various trial to get its mega stone to mega evolve it against an ancient non-pokemon enemy that can blow up planets. Which one of them would generate actual hype?
>>59685668>>59687350>Has to reply twice to the same post for attention Get a life or a job Fagmon.
Nobody likes Riko beyond wanting to fuck an underage girl
>>59687350They only care money, tcg is the biggest money machine they have now they are going to sell tcg packs with the movie
>>59687454Pokemon is not a TCG franschise, its not Cardfight Vanguard. They can still sell packs cards with regular movie instead of betting on an entire TCG movie.
>>59687350Now that you mentioned it, a DSOD direction with Ash and high quality animation might be one way to bring Ash back and generate hype, but it's clear OLM and TPC had their fair share of problems with Rica and don't want anything to do with her now.
>>59687505>but it's clear OLM and TPC had their fair share of problems with Rica and don't want anything to do with her now.If there was any actual scandal then OLM could easily replace Rica. Not to mention they can age Ash to 15 year old in the next series and use that to change his VA for a mature voice.
>>59687525If were not scandal ash wouldn’t be replaced
>ESLs don't care about Japan's sense of integrity If Pokemon has more morals than a self-inserting hobo in his 30s then enough is said to not entertain such crap.
>>59687486Pokemon tcg is the most selling tcg now, yes it’s a tcg franchise
>>59687525Japan plays it inconsistent with VAs. Sometimes they replace them, but it's often for characters with secondary roles who are ultimately replaceable, and it's a uphill battle even then. For characters with an iconic status or with their set of quirks like Ash, Goku, Naruto, or even those with simpler roles like Pikachu, the idea is viewed unconventionally. It's why they didn't replace May. Even if they received KAORI's approval, the character had her own unique catch phrases in Japanese that likely wouldn't sit right with the japanese audience if someone else replaced KAORI and started using her trademark characteristics that were associated with the original VA.
>>59687528Did you have a stroke or is your command of english this bad?
>>59687557It's fucking ridiculous that dubtards don't understand this when they collectively shat their diapers for like 10 years straight when the dub replaced all the "iconic" voices THEY grew up on and associated with the characters. Then you got shit like the Simpsons that's permanently killed off lots of characters because the VA died and they know fans wouldn't accept a replacement voice.
>>59687528>>59687533>>59687557Raihan's VA had even bigger scandal but that didn't stop Raihan from appearing as they just change his VA. Even TK & Kari from Digimon had different VA with TK having 3 different VA from Japan. Ash's popularity far too big be held by a single VA. Even Urusei Yatsura remake changed VA of both Lum & Ataru.Let be honest, outside of bunch of VA obsessed otaku in Japan, nobody give a dam about Ash's VA and those Otaku already know about Teraleak. Globally most people doesn't even know Rica and more attach to Veronica Taylor's voice as Ash than Rica. People who loves Ash want him back even if that means kicking out his VA.>>59687577>Then you got shit like the Simpsons that's permanently killed off lots of characters because the VA died and they know fans wouldn't accept a replacement voiceMinor character Would they kill off Bart if his VA dies?
>>59687580>Let be honest, outside of bunch of VA obsessed otaku in JapanGreat idea to antagonize the people who are the main demographic you fucking retard. This is why nobody takes your narcissistic bullshit seriously, Isdra/Famon. Then again, a clown who calls himself idealist online is a joke in the first place.
>>59687580Disney canceled their plans for a third Rescuers movie because Bianca's VA died.
>>59687587>Great idea to antagonize the people who are the main demographicThey aren't main demographic, they call themselves that but they are just minority. The actual main demographic are children who doesn't give a dam about VA and Ashfags who just want Ash back.
>>59687576>>59687580>Raihan's VA had even bigger scandal but that didn't stop Raihan from appearing as they just change his VA. Raihan was a secondary character and the VA publicly disgraced himself, allowing them more leeway to replace him.>Even TK & Kari from Digimon had different VA with TK having 3 different VA from Japan. >Even Urusei Yatsura remake changed VA of both Lum & Ataru.I haven't closely followed Digimon but I'm assuming the VA changes involved the aged up characters in the movies and the reboot, which again provides leeway to treat as a fresh start to replace some casts, especially after the VAs have gotten older and probably would have more difficulty in replicating a young voice. Ditto for the Urusei Yatsura remake.>Ash's popularity far too big be held by a single VA.It is in the west, but come on, Ash's Japanese VA is clearly on the same level of iconic status for the character in Japan the same way Nozawa is for Goku or Otani with Pikachu. It's only not seen as a major deal outside of Japan because the non-japanese audience already went through a voice change transition, but in Japan the VAs are on the same wavelength as actors in live-action films/series.
>>59687594>Japanese audience is not the main demographic of a Japanese company>Especially one that responds the fastest to Japanese concernsPeak retardation in this post. Get a job, getting back in touch with the real world is just a net positive at this point for you.
>>59687594Rica did tons and tons of live children's concerts and stage shows and was on TV on children's programmes all the time, everyone that watched the Pokemon anime in Japan knew who she was. Meanwhile nobody in the actual target demographic in the west know the names of the dub VAs, that's the realm of obsessed twitter nerds and confags that should've outgrown dubs long ago.
>>59687597Don't bother. That faggot always drags in non-Pokemon shows to make a point that doesn't apply to Pokemon while aggressively projecting his attitude onto others.
>30 anniversary of the ashnime nect year>movie is about the tcg and pichu clay animation Hahaha ashkeks on suicide
>>59685514Even with bad ratings he is never coming back lol
>>59687597>but I'm assuming the VA changes involved the aged up characters in the movies and the reboot,Wrong TK was voiced by Taisuke Yamamoto on Adventure 02 instead of Hiroko Konishi from the original and Junya Enoki voiced TK on Tri series. Kari had Mao Ichimichi as her new voice for TRI series. >especially after the VAs have gotten older and probably would have more difficulty in replicating a young voiceYou just gave the best excuse to replace Ash's VA as he is still 10 while Rica gotten too old to voice a child like him. >It is in the west, but come on, Ash's Japanese VA is clearly on the same level of iconic status for the character in Japan the same way Nozawa is for Goku or Otani with PikachuNot with Rica as her popularity died with Teraleak. As I said, people obsessed with VA already knows controversy surround Rica involving the Teraleak and why she has to go.
>>59687601But to children, she is just a singer and not Ash. Even Doraemon & Nobita had new VA since 2005 while their original VA passed away on 2024.
She won rica literally who?
>>59687625>But to children, she is just a singer and not Ash.
>>59685550Ash is based on Red, so it's a given, he just branched off into his own character as time went on, you can see this in the fact Ash's Kanto design is just a recolor of Gen 1 Red's design
>>59687625>Even Doraemon & Nobita had new VA since 2005 while their original VA passed away on 2024.Ok now that's a fair point.Consider this, however: Ash as a character was a very blank slate that was just characterized as being a pokemaniac and had inconsistent character development. Perhaps they see the character as a hassle to continue working with at a setting that can work perfectly fine without him, conceptually. All they'd need is write a better character.Additionally, the Doraemon case might have been the VAs getting tired of their repetitive role and having seen the 2005 relaunch as the perfect point to drop off after their 20+ years of service, but I think my previous point holds more weight. The Pokemon IP as a whole doesn't depend on the Ash brand anymore, and it's one of the few settings that's theoretically built for horizontal story-telling than revolving the events on one character, just like in the games.
>>59687125The Persona 5 collab effect seems to have an influence on others.
>>59687652Yeah, the game character being explicitly named Red wasn't a thing until gen 2, originally they used both Red and Satoshi as names for him. There's several manga that call him Satoshi despite not having anything to do with the anime too.The entire "Ash isn't Red he's just based on him" is just autists trying to force a separation between a character they like and a character they don't like. Ash isn't any more different from Red than Brock is different from Brock.
>>59687665Don't drag other IPs into this. Keep it strictly about Pokemon, why are you using them as a benchmark despite them having a clear cut line on the matter? Don't feed the ego of that obnoxious lolcow who wants Pokemon to copy non-Pokemon shows.
>>59687674They're basically competitor kids anime ? Why not?
>>59687665>Consider this, however: Ash as a character was a very blank slate that was just characterized as being a pokemaniac and had inconsistent character development.Ash had consistent character development from OS to DP series so they just need to bring that version back instead of trying to change him like XY series did. If anything, Ash is probably one of the few long running anime protagonist that actually had a character development unlike Goku, Luffy, Nobita and Conan. >Perhaps they see the character as a hassle to continue working with at a setting that can work perfectly fine without him, conceptually. All they'd need is write a better character.Horizons pretty much proven that the setting of pokemon anime works with an fully developed protagonist like Ash instead of trying to shove a newbie in his role.
>>59687674I believe OLM operates in a similar wavelength as other animation studios in Japan, but I gave a plausible reason to why they're likely not going to bother with Ash even if there isn't any such restrictions.
>>59687673Yeah, there is a timeline his name would have been Ash/Satoshi in the games, as well as his rival being Gary/Shigeru (honestly the first game protagonist being named after the creator of the series would have been neat)But they went out of their way to make them both different characters later, so the name different made senseFRLG's redesign of Red giving him a different hairstyle and color (despite people still making the confusion of him and Ash) feels like the final nail in the coffin that they wanted them to be viewed as different characters going forward
>>59687677Pokemon is Pokemon, Doraemon is Doraemon. Telling someone to copy someone else is undermining the things they're doing for themselves. Why should Pokemon compromise despite valuing Kaori so much? They made it clear, the Japanese respect that too. That lolcow is literally obsessed with whatever fotw or fotm is catching his leeching self-inserting faggotry: https://arch.b4k.dev/vp/search/text/Ash/filename/example/https://arch.b4k.dev/vp/search/text/Ash/filename/Images/start/2026-10-01/If you value your brain cells, don't give that moron any more attention.
>>59687665For Doraemon, the main reason the 2005 reboot happened at all was because Oyama was retiring from voice acting due to health reasons. They took the opportunity to retool the entire show and replace pretty much the entire creative staff to signalize the end of one era and the beginning of a new one instead of just continuing on and weirding fans out with a different voice for Doraemon only. That's how important that one voice was.
>>59687686They're not "different characters" any more than anime Giovanni and game Giovanni are different characters. The anime retools and changes characters a ton, especially early one, but only game characters that ended up with different names in the anime are Red/Ash and Green/Gary, and that's really just a result of the game characters having two different names to begin with.
>>59687689And now because of Pokemon Horizon, they can start a new era of Ashnime with Ash & May returning with new VA on Generation 10.
>>59685514Ash was great when he was like every other kid who played the games for the first time. A newbie who would fuck up and mostly relied on dumb luck.Then they made him some kind of destiny thing and even Pikachu was just naturally more powerful than any other Pikachu. It wasn't hard work, no, he's just better than you and you can't catch up ever.
>>59687691>ASH AS ASH ASH PLEASE THEY HAVE TO BEND OVER TO MEYou are one sad individual.
>>59687692>Then they made him some kind of destiny thing and even Pikachu was just naturally more powerful than any other Pikachu.That what started with Yajima and its even worse in Horizons with Liko having magic bloodline and Roy became Mary Sue though offscreen training. At least Ash & Pikachu had 20 years of character development to explain they being stronger than regular trainer & Pikachu. Especially since Ash was already qualified to win the league at the end of Johto but instead they made him struggle for 23 years just so he could win a village league.
> Pokemon Boom > Premise : After the disbandment of Team Rocket & disappearance of Giovanni, Dr Bumba recruits Jessie , James & Meowth to rebuild Team Rocket from scratch. His plan involve using various pokemon as power source for his various weapon. But stand in his way are a group of five kids (Ash ketchum, Nerd, Eye-candy, Wild Girl, Muscle-headed idiot) that investigate strange anomaly and often ruins his plan. Basically Dr Bimba becomes Dr Eggmon of pokemon world.
>>59687690Red and Ash have completely different personalities, so they are blatantly different characters now, Ash has long branched off into his own person different from RedThe only thing really connecting them now is the fact they both use a Pikachu
>>59685514>the character that represented the human face of the franchise for 3 decades, with nostalgic ties to multiple generations of fans, and a name so recognizable moms even know who ash ketchum is>Why is he more popular than random no names that like 100 children and one 4chan autist know of?The better question is how did they not see it as a massive risk with no possible reward? In what universe were whatever you called them going to be more popular than ash?
>>59687125It’s like the Teen Titans Go curse.
>>59687725Brock and Brock have completely different personalities, so they are blatantly different characters now, Brock has long branched off into his own person different from Brock.
Liko a cute.
>>59687739Yeah, you keep yapping about that, but it's pretty clear Ash and Red are different characters, which the series has made the choice of leaning into being different people, regardless of whatever shit you are trying to counter withhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhu7yjELvbUhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwY4DTlOzRo
>>59687728You have it backwards. No one has given a shit about Ash after the orange islands. The anime isn’t popular because of Ash. ash is propped up due to the anime.
>>59687770> One of most well known protagonist as iconic as Goku & Usagi who carried the anime for decades without special privileges. > N-nobody care about Ash because b-because I said so okay. Just like nobody cares about Naruto huh!
>>59687791those series are based in manga, pokemon is a videogame and every new game change protagonist, pokemon etc..thats why ash went shit after the first gen and reseted everytime
People say it’s Rica’s fault that Ash was removed, but the truth is that Pokémon has gone full "woke" now, and Ash’s design and personality just don’t fit anymore.
>>59687808>pokemon is a videogame and every new game change protagonist,Anime = / = GameThe game is basically a self inserted fake world specifically made for the protagonist. It may work as wish fulfillment for the player playing them but it does not work in anime. Indigo Disk has how unfair the world of the game happens to be when you are an NPC. Ashnime never followed the game story, it was a separate thing written more like Nekketsu/Shonen anime. Those anime survive though their premise and popularity of their original main character and removing them remove the core reason for people to follow those anime.
You see they wanted replace him since journeys with gou an androgynous boy, they went full woke in gen 9
>>59687725>The only thing really connecting them now is the fact they both use a Pikachu>and that they're both from Pallet Town>and that they're both childhood friends turned rivals with Professor Oak's grandson>and that they both have all three Kanto starters, and Snorlax,>and that they both challenged Brock using Pikachu https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1KI9zUOt8Vg>and that they both battled Surge's Raichu with their Pikachu
>>59687820>personalityHe hasn't had a personality in literally decades
>>59687739Here, one Brock leaks into the other constantly so they end up merging, but this happens very sparingly with Red & Ash.>>59687125Pokemon Sleep is sleeping with the fishes?
>>59687864Nether does Liko & Roy .If they can't even nail Ash's consistent personality from OS to DP series then what luck they ever had with new protagonist!
>>59687865>Here, one Brock leaks into the other constantly so they end up mergingDo they? I can think of very little of anime Brock that's made it into the game version. The anime is a flirt, can be very eccentric, jokes around, and desires to nurture Pokemon whether it be first as a breeder or later as a doctor. The game version is described to rarely laugh or drop his serious demeanor. The only thing that seemed to carry over from the anime is that he's described to watch over and support new trainers like he did with Ash.I wish they did merge anime Brock and Misty with their game counterparts because every storyline in Mastersex focusing on them highlights how there's absolutely nothing to them.
>>59685640>tranimeno such thing, kill yourself
> The most popular character from Horizons is Sango > She is also the most stupidest character of the show No wonder the anime wanted Ash to remain dumb.
>>59687525>If there was any actual scandal then OLM could easily replace Rica.Japanese are VERY autistic in regards of seiyuu acting, if by any chance any of them dies (or lost their voice) in middle production you can bet the rest of screen time said character might have will be relegated to silent apparitions with a gradual phasing out, even if said character is the MC, heck they might even use AI generated voice rather than change of seiyuu
>>59688178not only japanese but tpc is even worse, she used ash voice and insulted people
>>59686188>Most of it was the same filler bullshit as the old animeBlatantly false, you aren't fooling anyone.
>>59686562>The anime worked best when expanding on game characters and loreso never
>>59687652And?>>59687681>character development Why is that a good thing?
who cares? new pokemon and games are ugly shit
>>59687820What personality? He didn't have one for 99.9% of his run as the protagonist. And his design changed over time. He looked like a Mexican during the Alola era that coincided with peak woke.It's 100% Rica's fault. Ash was on borrowed time as it was with one (1) autistic executive at TPC being the sole reason he had remained the MC for so long. She gave literally everyone else involved with the anime who had wanted to be done with Ash for 15+ years everything they needed to finally force a change.
>>59685514Go woke go broke.Japan isnt immune to DEI
>>59685514I don't know, why aren't you white?
>>59688223>He didn't have one for 99.9% of his run as the protagonist.Coming from a retard whose idea of character development is just magically becoming taller handsome with powerup & fangirls like Jin-woo. Ash's character went though considerable change from OS to DP series with each series introducing more mature improved Ash while also maintaining his core character. The Ash from just Johto was already more developed than the Ash from Kanto. Everything went downhill from BW series because some executive wanted to shove their garbage OC like Trip and Alain so they purposefully ruined his character to shill them. Its retards like you still shouting "change" because everytime Anipoke did this, it went downhill. They removed Brock & made TRio serious on BW series & it became the worst series. They tried mature story with heroic Ash on XY series & it got mogged by Youkai Watch. SM & JN completely changed the formula and people like you ended up hating it. They removed Ash altogether on Pokemon 2023 and it became even worst than BW series.
>>59688316>from OS to DP seriesI ALWAYS hate this take, because DP is the first series that noticeably revamped his character. People don't care because they like like that version of him, but he's absolutely not the same Ash from RS. DP Ash is big on theory and workshipping in the same way XY Ash is into hotblooded yelling.
>>59688325>because DP is the first series that noticeably revamped his characteDP series kept Ash's competitive snarky and hot headed personality. He simply just matured more than his past self instead of losing his entire personality on XY series. Don't believe me than go & watch Ash's Gligar's evolution episode.
>>59685534Thread just started and anti-ashschizo is already here.
What anipoke should have done was not removing Ash but followed the steady path to Ash's progression laid down from OS series instead of butchering it on Best Wishes. It should have gone like --> Ash loses the Unova League to N's Zekrem but soon return with a Rashirem to challenge him to a rematch on Team Plasma arc. When N loses, Ghetis reveal he had Colress brainwash Kyurem as plan B that absorbs Ash's Dragon to become white kyurem but it gets defeated in a raid battle after Zekrem super charge Pikachu who hurls a gigantic Electro Ball as Kyurem.while all the gym leader restrain him. > Ash defeat Alain and wins his first league conference only to get destroyed by Drasna on Champion League. > Ash's island Challenge on Alola gets treated as training after his loss to Drasna.> Ash participate on Galar Cup and manage to defeat Leon but refuse to take the title. > Paldea has the actual World Championship with Leon no longer having undefeated plot armor therefore his final opponent could be anybody including Nemona or Gary .
>>59688325Pretty much. Even though I like DP I think Ash in that series is one of his most boring iterations. Advanced Hoenn may have dialed up his cockiness too much but I at least enjoyed watching him there more.
>>59688212this, I don’t see the point of bringing Ash back if they’re just going to keep using that horrible new art style.
>>59688378There was no path. If you kept watching after the Johto loss you were already ok with dogshit.
>>59688401> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1YE9OlstpM&t=119sHow much money will it take to make an entire series on this artstyle? Also what is the point of replacing Ash with a new protagonist if writers needs an experienced protagonist that can have rivalry with champion & defeat a freaking Rayquaza to catch it?
>>59688424to build that mc up. that's how these stories usually go. its a simple template you'll likely see on your second anime.if anything its baffling they butchered their first attempt
>>59687898The localizer of Mastersex inserted a le funny jelly donuts reference, I assume that's what he's referring to.
>>59688395https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IoWVzwjAIls
>>59688472>to build that mc up.If they wanna build the MC up then they shouldn't have stories when newbie protagonist has to take challenge way above their league. Especially after they spend more than 20 years establishing how strong and important core legendary pokemon are to be owned by human. >that's how these stories usually goAnd those stories flops hard like Boruto.
>>59688498>If they wanna build the MC up then they shouldn't have stories when newbie protagonist has to take challenge way above their league. Which is why they get the MC progresively to that league. That is called progress.>Especially after they spend more than 20 years establishing how strong and important core legendary pokemon are to be owned by human. Tobias.
>>59685514Liko is white, Roy is black. People are sick of interracial slop.
>>59688518They aren't together.
>>59688522Doesn't matter. Roy has a white mom and a black dad. Liko is white and Roy is black and this dynamic is never acceptable in any media ever.
Fagmon has been more restless than usual. Nervous about sleeping on benches in winter?
>>59688504>Which is why they get the MC progresively to that league. That is called progress.Doing Hoge Hoge Hoge to magically become champion level is not progress.>TobiasNon-protagonist experienced trainer with sub-legendary pokemon and didn't had any core legendary pokemon.
>>59688542Ash should end up with tan or dark skin girls to make them seethe.
>>59688581>sub-legendaryKek, you don't even know much about the games either.
>>59688412Even Johto made it hard to watch through with the horrendous padding. It was the perfect time to stop watching the series
>>59687820>"woke"What are you talking about?
>>59687652>>59687673>>59687686>>59687690>>59687865For what it's worth, at least they still share a similar taste in fashion.
>>59688585I know more than you.
>>59689223>Continues to lieJust get a job, Fagmon. Maybe you can afford to actually buy a switch and the games.
>>59688792Ash's clothes from Sinnoh all the way to Kalos are inspired by each of the male protagonist outfits from each respective game, seeing as he became a stand in for them (down to traveling with the female player character a lot of the time May/Dawn/Serena and also Lyra for a couple of episodes during the DP anime)Makes me kind of wish Gen 1 had a female player character to see if she would have gotten the same treatment
>>59689428Sinnoh Ash's outfit is kind of a mix of Gen 3 Red and Lucas. It's basically Frlg Red's silhouette mixed with Lucas' colir schene
likoslop floppedreturn to rootsmake a male protagonist with good design who travels through different regions and has to deal with team rocket style shenanigansthat's what people loved about the pokemon anime
Remember that even Decolore Journey was like only 22 episode long while Horizon going to push Wonder Voyage for one year & half.
here is why the new anime doesn't work they aged up the characterstoo many girlsno kieran
>>59689428To Alola you mean. The only thing they changed from Elio's design was the color of the hat.
>>59689796Yeah, I admit I forgot about Alola, you're right
I do not understand why the anime could not have just used a formula of having the current game protags as MCs, follow the plot of the current game with an actual conclusion, and reset for the next mainline game.Simple and effective.
>>59690023>I do not understand why the anime could not have just used a formula of having the current game protags as MCs, follow the plot of the current game with an actual conclusion, and reset for the next mainline game.Because the protagonist has to be a Mary Sue who would defeat gym leader way more experience & professional than them few days after they receive their first level 05 starters. Original series bypassed this by having Ash get pity badge on Kanto while gaining enough experience from his Indigo & Orange Island journey to take on gym leaders but this was an one time trick. It got even worst with Ohmori keep putting E4 tier trainer as gym leader such as Larry, Raihan and two Kahuna. Seriously what is wrong with him? The protagonist has to be an one of a kind prodigy born after 1000 just to complete the gym challenge in Ohmori's game.
>>59685514Everyone wanted to fuck Ash. No one wants to fuck Leeko
>>59690023It's a bit silly as well, since they needed to nerf Ash each region anyway, by having him only take Pikachu, so he can start overThis still doesn't make sense, since Ash's experience as a Trainer, and Pikachu's strength would carry over into the next region, so this attempt at resetting him doesn't even work, had they just used a different protagonist in each region, it would have made a lot more sense on why they reset in power
>>59690100Some people still doesn't understand.BW series was the only time Ash's experience was nerfed as he maintained his battling skill & experience in other series. However just because Ash has experience doesn't mean all his new pokemon will magically have the same level of experience as his past pokemon when he catch them. They need to level up and earn experience to fight stronger opponent. Ash doesn't have super power like E-pulse to boost them, he needs to train them and make them earn experience by battling others. Even now , if Ash catches a Nymble and challenge Katie and Lokix to a battle than he might lose or struggle even as world champion because his Nymble is still inexperienced. The fact that Pokemon trainer can be nerfed like this make it easy for Ash's story to continue even after winning the Master Tournament.
>>59690110He still has Pikachu however, who should be able to hard carry him till his other Pokemon catch up
>the same damn threads>the same damn posts>the same DAMN Mary Sue spamI feel like I'm stuck in an insane asylum listening to the same voices in my head that won't shut up. How can anyone stand this shit?
>>59685514liko design is fucking boring and unnapealing and she looks worse in the timeskip, look popular female protagonists designs like precure
>makes a whole episode based on Unite>Unite flops and EoS
>>59690086jej
>>59690110>>59690135This was perfectly demonstrated by his defeat against Misty at the end of the series; unlike Leon, Ash no longer fears defeat—he learns from it. Furthermore—much to Pikachu’s annoyance—he prefers to battle in a way that stays true to his own style, rather than acting like an efficiency machine focused solely on statistics and type advantages.
>>59690198Just for the sake of comparison, look at how each of them reacted to the same event—being defeated by their childhood girl friend in a casual battle: Leon was left feeling resentful, with the bitter taste of defeat, whereas for Ash, it was a good battle, and he congratulated his Pokémon.
>>59690202Exactly, Leon is an analogy for what might have become of an older Ash had he remained bitter following his defeat in Kanto, with his story as a protagonist ending right there.
>>59690110>BW series was the only time Ash's experience was nerfed as he maintained his battling skill & experience in other seriesPikachu was still nerfed in AG and DP although not as egregiously. With AG it's sorta acceptable since Pikachu wasn't a undisputed powerhouse in OS, but Pikachu went tieing to a Elekid and losing to other Pokémon in DP shortly after having defeated Regice.
>>59690086
>>59685514Because he's cool unlike the foid and the coon
>>59690228Is this rape?
>>59690135Pikachu was hard carrying him in many series. However Pokemon follows more Rock-paper-Scissor powerscaling therefore there are opponent it can't just beat.
>>59690216Pikachu got buff on AG when its learn "Iron Tail" , heck you gotta ask how Pikachu on Johto survive without Iron Tail. Pikachu always has the bad track record against Elekid family line as it never won against Electabuzzz and even lost to Gary's Electvire after Battle Frontier. Pikachu was never nerf here, Electivire was simply the superior electric type pokemon than Pikachu .
liko a cute
>>59690198>>59690202I don't know what's worse. That you asked Claude or Chatgpt to write this bs or that you've been using LLMs so much that you actually type like this.
>>59690329>However Pokemon follows more Rock-paper-Scissor powerscalingThe anime barely even takes into account type advantages, Ash's whole battle style revolves around him being unorthodox compared to a normal Trainer, since he rarely seems to care about type match ups and still wins a lot of the time, so this doesn't seem to matter
>>59688636Oh yeah, definitely, that's were I dropped it.The Jhoto loss is the absolute final point.>>59689223watching poketubers is not knowing.
>>59689754Reasonable people already know delaying a game for a year and a half means a long delay than half a year, yeah.But I guess its news to ashfags.>>59690083Given how much ashfags criticize horizon for not being a straight video game adaptation I don't see why should they have an issue with a straight video game adaptation. Unless
>>59685514liko is so shit and ugly thats why flopped, the same reason best wishes and journeys were disliked ugly main girls, may dawn serena and alola girls carried those seasons
>>59690365>The anime barely even takes into account type advantages,Doesn't matter because there were gap Pikachu couldn't beat even with Ash's strategy. Pokemon doesn't follow the standard A lost to B & C beat B so C is stronger than A type of powerscale. Its more like Rock-Paper-Scissor which makes it interesting. >>59690375>Reasonable people already know delaying a game for a year and a half means a long delay than half a year,Reasonable people also knows that Anipoke can do better than shoving an filler saga for one year. >Given how much ashfags criticize horizon for not being a straight video game adaptationRegular fans does, not Ashfags.Ashfags criticize Horizon for its fanfic tier writing where the pokemon world bends to Liko & Roy's will.
>>59690266It doesn’t count if the rapist is a sexy girl.
>>59690341Electivire was understandable since, as you mentioned, it's a fully evolved electric type Pokémon stronger than Pikachu and was squared off against two of Ash's strongest rivals. The problem was Pikachu tying to Paul's Elekid, which looks weak even if you consider Paul's talent as a trainer (though I guess Pikachu winning against strong opponents is also egregious and wouldn't happen without plot armor).
>>59690392>Regular fans does, not Ashfags.Kek, fans of what.
>>59690400>The problem was Pikachu tying to Paul's Elekid,Paul simply had better strategy like using Protect against Volt Tackle and use one arm to block Iron Tail so Elekid's other arm will be free to hit Pikachu . The episode specifically mentioned how Volt Tackle harm the user.
>>59690400Also forgot to mention, Pikachu's track record against other Electric type pokemon was never good to begin with.
>>59690392>Ashfags criticize Horizon for its fanfic tier writing where the pokemon world bends to Liko & Roy's willThe irony is this is exactly the case with Ash, in fact the movies are always stuff that just so happen when Ash is in the area, making it seem like the Pokemon world is only active when Ash is around
>>59690392Pot meet kettle
>>59685514One of them is black. It's really that simple.
Japan only like cute girls not abomination like liko and iris
>>59690352Very molestable.
>>59690417Excuse me but Ash practically treated like a side character in his own movies , its hardly call a fanfic. Youkai Watch first movie ended with Keita using his Youkai Watch to summon an army of Youkai to fight the main villain and then fuse Jibanyan with Whisper to defeat the villain's final form. Compared to that, what Ash ever get to done in his movie? Nothing! No wonder pokemon movie started to flop because nobody gives a dam about a serious story about Mewtwo searching for his purpose, they just wanna see Ash& his pokemon attain a new form to take down main villain in an epic showdown with Fake criticism like yours infuriate me.
>>59690436Pre-time skip Liko is a cute girl tho
>>59690532what the cat doin
>>59685701Sadly Digimon is going all in on Tai wank
>>59690537Cat things I assume
>this thread getting more attention than the anime threadThat's... so sad! At least Liko is cute!
>>59685701>>59690538Tai is their Red/Ash, Digimon Adventure is their Gen 1, and Omnimon/Omegamon is their CharizardThis happens to pretty much all series with a shifting cast of charactersYu-Gi-Oh has Yugi and his Dark MagicianMonster Hunter has the Rathalos and Felyne (Which might as well be their Charizard and Pikachu equivalents with how much the two are used)Yo-Kai Watch has Nate and Jibanyan
>>59690549That's because negativity breeds attention. Also it's one guy trying way too hard.
>two days>People are still seething Hilarous
>>59690521>Fake criticism like yours infuriate me.Your own posts make you mad?>>59690589ashfags have been seething since pokespe got scans at least.
>>59690630Ashfags are insufferably annoying, I'm glad the character was retired, should have came far sooner
she won>>59690610
>>59685514They mishandled fucking everything with Ash and everything afterwards is a downstream of their Kalos league fuckup.
>>59690664Imagine Horizons ends with Treasure of Ruins arc and next series is basically a remake & soft reboot of the Master Tournament arc with better animation that rewrite many things such as Ash getting Mega Lucario Z, defeating Alain in place of Drasna , Tobias replacing Alain on Master Eight , Ash using his reserve, Leon actually using Eternatus against Ash etc etc.
>>59690689sure keep dreaming
>>59690689Pokemon battles are not allowed in the anime anymorem its too violent and its no woke
>>59690538>>59690551this muh breatbreak.. lmao already flopgotten meanwhile tai and their friend still the most popular
>>59690701The only other series that could even hope to rival it is Tamers, but they don't do shit with it, and since the creator of Tamer made that audio drama with cancel culture as the main antagonist, it sounds like they're too scared to do anything with the series again for a long time
>>59690689That doesn't fix everything that went wrong with the Kalos league and beyond. They fucked themselves really hard, and going back to Ash is a cope move on their part because their handling of the character is what led to this point.
>>59690714bur he is not coming back liko neither, they are going to be new oc for gen 10 anime and not more long running
>>59690714Bringing new protagonist won't going to fix everything that went wrong with Kalos League. There always be a lack of closure until Ash gets to defeat Alain in a rematch & his Mega Charizard X in a rematch while Alain faces actual consequences for his mistake. Pokemon Legends Z-A given the best chance for a Kalos arc where Ash wins his rematch against Alain, work with AZ to erase the remaining dark vine while Alain faces consequences when people of Lumoise city blame him for reemergence of Dark vine on Kalos instead of treating him like some victim and Manon finally gets a Mega Chesnaught which she uses to defeat Alain (Something that she deserve since Mega Evolution Special 04). Almost as if Ash was removed to protect Alain.
>>59690734It's really obvious with how badly Leon beat Alain, and Ash barely beat Leon, after being given loads of advantages in their battle that Ash should be at the level where he'd beat Alain with a light struggle, just going off their respective showings against LeonIt was like Alain hadn't improved at all since XY how badly he was stomped, which would carry over into battling Ash anyway
>>59690737>It's really obvious with how badly Leon beat Alain, and Ash barely beat Leon, after being given loads of advantages in their battle that Ash should be at the level where he'd beat Alain with a light struggle, just going off their respective showings against LeonThis type of scaling does not work on Pokemon that follows rock-paper-scissor scaling. Not to mention it was Alain's first battle against Leon and even Ash lost to him and many other trainer during his first fight against them before he defeated them in rematch. Writers knows Proxy win does not work with pokemon and they even had Ash use three gimmicks against Leon. That's why they let their precious Alain lose to Leon so he could be one of the Master 08. Alain is the person Ash has to defeat directly for full closure on XY&Z.
>>59690744The person Ash has to truly defeat for true closure is Tobias. Tobias could still wipe the floor with any other trainer.
>>59690746Outside of defeating Ash on Sinnoh League, Tobias has no other connection to Ash. He is basically no different than Tyson. Harrison and Richie.While not only Alain was introduced as a rival before Ash got his 8th badge but this scumbag made every bad decision that nearly lead to mass genocide and Ash was forced to take responsibility for Alain mess by releasing his Greninja. Both Ash and Manon has the right to humiliate Alain in battle so badly that all future writers would think twice before bringing another Alain and self insert as them.
>>59690657such as?
>>59690746If you got to see Tobias you don't care about closure to be fair.
>>59690193>Mastersex makes three entire sync pairs based on the ashnime>Ashnime flops and gets canceled
>>59690777> A Doormat female protagonist whose only defining trait is being nice & having magic ancestor. Even simp like Serena seem like a better character in comparison.> An entire ship full of useless boring adults > The main villain acts like he has this mysterious big plan and goal which turned out to be nothing. > The villain team are even more incompetent than TRio > Somehow the villain openly sells steroid to children yet all the people are dumb down to be idiot so only the main character smart enough to notice that. > Law enforcement had to be erased and not a single officer Jenny appeared in the show for villain to be a threat. > Geeta is somehow even more useless and weaker than her game version. > Molly is a garbage woke excuse for a nurse that the anime still haven't bring Miriam in the series. > Zygarde supposed to be the guardian of ecosystem of pokemon yet somehow it deemed a manchild who wants to harm the ecosystem worthy to be his partner instead of smiting him & then decides to serve his grandchild > Turn out doing "Hoge Hoge Hoge" & training offscreen is enough to defeat a core legendary pokemon like Rayquaza. > Roy is basically just the Mary Sue version of Ash with none of his charm , efforts & character development. > An annoying Green hair brat who wants to be the strongest trainer but instead of catching more pokemon & take gym challenge, he just follows Roy and want Rayquaza because Roy wants it. > Another Loli whose goal is to find her goal, as if the anime already didn't had Liko for that.
https://arch.b4k.dev/vp/search/text/%22hoge%20hoge%22/>Searching for posts that contain ‘"hoge hoge"’. 70 results found.
>>59685514>why did Ash workedgood morning saar
>>59690701Not anymore. They literally had to rename the series of reruns they're doing right now from "The Best Adventure" to "World's Best Picks" because the Adventure brand has become so toxic for Digimon in most of the world. Most fans now hate Adventure, and Taichi has plummeted down to the level of Ash, Deku, Eren, and the Kanokari fag as far as protagonists are concerned.
>>59685514Ash didn't work, though. I got bored of him halfway through the Orange Islands arc, which is when I stopped watching the anime entirely. Knowing that the game MCs weren't going to be the stars of each region sealed the deal - I have no interest in watching the same dude make the same stupid mistakes, learn the same stupid lessons, and have his character development reset just so he can do it all over again year after year, and I cannot fathom how anyone who isn't critically brain damaged could get any enjoyment out of that.
>>59691202> One of the most iconic protagonist.> Carried the series for decades without any special privileges.> A-Ash didn't work cause c-cause I said so.Off course he didn't work for loser whose Ideal standard for protagonist is Jin-woo.
>>59691340>Carried the series for decades without any special privilegesAsh-Greninja
>>59691393> Weaker than Mega Evolved pokemon > Jobbed to Mega Charizard X that Ash should've gotten.> Only in the series to job to Alain and got released to clean Alain's mess .> Being erased and purged from pokemon.There is nothing special about Ash-Greninja. Anything comes after that are just damaged control for Alain and Kalos to protect Alain.
https://arch.b4k.dev/vp/search/text/Alain%20damage%20control/start/2023-05-01/>Can't shut up about Alain unprompted for years>Accuses others of wanting non-Pokemon while justifying his own insertion of copying non-pokemon shitI would kill myself if I ever became a hobo and ended up like that fag.
>>59690811I asked for legitimate criticism famon.>>59690843>Most fans now hate AdventureKek
>>59685514Becuz middle aged spics can't self insert as a little girl Also this youtuber is brown and a roy fan btw
>>59691429> Give legitimate criticism> N-no , those are not legitimate c-cause cause I've no argument again it. Cope.
>>59685514Because third world browns self inserted as him.
>>59687046Sounds like a cope from Borutofag.
likoshit floppedjust make a male protag next time and bring back team rocket instead of pandering to rabid troons who love self insert OCs
>>59691837like, what even is this shiti know tpc has fully embraced DEI, but this is seriously vomit inducingi was told this is the team rocket equivalent and they all look fugly and most likely also have an incredibly annoying fanbase just like fagscarada's fanbase
>>59691837Bringing TR back would kill the whole point.>>59691841>i was told this is the team rocket equivalent by who?
>The Boruto Manga is pretty goodHahahaha, not even worth my (You)
>>59691763Got it , Everybody that hates Ash are ether racist or woke.
>>59691837>just make a male protag next timeOr simply just bring Ash back .
>>59691848checks outi have noticed that feminists and queers are the most racist and classist dipshits
>>59691849eh, he was an ok protag, but there's no need to bring him back eitherthe solution is extremely simplejust make a likeable male protag and give him good companions like brock and dawn, and have the gang deal with team rocket shenanigansmaybe even ditch team rocket and make an entirely new trio that are just as funny and likeable as tr trioit's such a simple fix, but they want to pander their woke annoying american fanbase
>>59691856>woke annoying american fanbasethen they'd absolutely bring ash back
>>59691856>just make a likeable male protag and give him good companions like brock and dawn, and have the gang deal with team rocket shenanigansYou basically asking for another Ash clone , I rather prefer actual Ash over any other Ash clone. The solution is simple : Just bring Ash back and have him travel with Brock & an very cute girl that get ship teased with Ash as they travel though Gen 10 region to raise the seed pokemon to find the mysterious Island while an serious evil organization and TRio stalks them.
>>59691862Woke fanbase hates Ash for criticizing same sex relationship in the original series on Japanese dub.
Lessons learned from today's thread about Ashfags:>Are happy to drag in off-topic manga or anime to make a point that doesn't exist in Pokemon or accuse others of wanting Pokemon to copy off-topic manga/anime with their characters unprompted (Textbook example of projection)>Are perfectly content being ignorant by ignoring cultures of voice actor roles in the country their SI is from>Drag in politics or other buzzword equivalents of the time to get attention And apparently they can't even spell the user handle of the youtuber they took the OP image from in the filename right.People used to say to stop stereotyping groups of people but somehow this thread is a case study on letting complete retardation, schizophrenia, /pol/shit or all of the three combined run rampant without consequences whether online or in their personal lives (in which the latter got reduced by their own decisions to cater the former)
>>59691856also another thingi really didn't like ash once he started getting special treatment starting from gen 6ooh he has a special battle form greninja! ooh he has a new dusk form lycanroc! ooh he caught a meltan! ooh he caught a naganadel!so ridiculousthe show worked well when he was just an ordinary trainer who worked hard on his monshis dp series really was the peak of pokemon animejust an ordinary trainer who trained his mons according to his own way and managed to win against his most challenging rival>>59691872and?there's nothing wrong with him, but i'm going to assume there will be mass suicides from the annoying woke fanbase if he ever returns on the screenso might as well just make a new male protag that shares the same traits, along with what else worked bestbring back funny goofballs like team rocket triomake the show about a trainer challenging a league, traveling with companions, dealing with team rocket shenanigans, and the occasional fillerthere was nothing wrong with itbringing back ash would be funny since the woke faggots really hate him for some reason
ah i see r/pokemoncirclejerk is here againno wonder they started seething about ash immediately
>>59691874You were constantly joking about Ash being with Go.
>>59691891Isn't reddit full of ashfags?
>>59691879 (Me)Looks like we can add unprompted site insertions as well to divert the issues away to undermine facts raised that compromised anime discussion. A generous thank you to >>59691891 for underlining the matter at hand.
yup, confirmed all the dilating seethe is coming from r/pokemoncirclejerkthey aren't satisfied with banning people 24/7 over there, so they have to ruin 4chan as well
>>59690384> Ash return with his OG snarky hotheaded personality who gets agitated easily. > Serena return with playful genki personality like her new TCG card who constantly tease & flirt with Ash. > Brock return and often acts as the middleman between Ash & Serena while also cries over still not finding a girlfriend. > They returns to Kalos after Dark Vine start popping up in Paldea ( Kalos & Paldea shares border) > Ash, Serena, Brock, Manon, Clemont gets new mega evolved pokemon> Ash defeat Alain & his Mega Charizard X. > They meet AZ and learn that Ange is responsible for making new vines after Team Flare tempered with Prism Tower. > The main Team Rocket & Giovanni are interested in Ange. > Both group searches for AZ's Floette as a way to deactivate or control Ange. See how easy is to make an one year long series. >>59691886>there's nothing wrong with him, but i'm going to assume there will be mass suicides from the annoying woke fanbase if he ever returns on the screen Good, they are everything wrong with the Internet.
>>59691892I never did that, who are you mistaking me for? I wanted Marnie or Green to appear in JN as the 3rd research fellow.
>>59691841That’s what Nupoopmon looks like; actually
>>59691340> Carried the series for decades without any special privileges.He most certainly DID have "special privileges". Dude got most of his badges in the first season without having to actually fight for them - everyone just handed them to him after he dealt with the Problem of the Day instead of doing their jobs and assessing his combat capabilities in a one-on-one duel. The few times he actually did fight, he basically cheated by ignoring rules, like setting off the sprinklers to beat Brock. It was pretty obvious that at that point he wasn't a capable enough fighter to actually win his badges the proper way, so he got them all through some bullshit or another. As a kid growing up and playing Version Red alongside watching the anime, I wanted to see Ash put together proper teams and have all the same epic battles against the gym leaders that I was having, not watch him win because of plot related bullshit.
>>59691995absolute state of nu poopmonfrom making fun of crossdressing faggots (it's so funny that troons think james dressing up as woman was pro-tranny propaganda) and having actual feminine females, to this
>>59692010
>>59692007>Dude got most of his badges in the first season without having to actually fight for themAsh was a complete newbie on first season going up against trainers more experienced than him , It was actually realistic because gym leader's job is to test trainer (not winning battle) & he passed their test. He still got humiliated on Indigo League instead winning the whole thing by doing Hoge Hoge Hoge.Even Liko & Dot passed their Terastal test without defeating the gym leaders.
>>59692010>>59692014I giggled a bit about how triggered brown people make you.
>>59692022why do you even bother replying to retards?they wanted ash to defeat onix with a single tackle and then catch mewtwo and rape the entire leaguethis is why the latter series started feeling bad compared to the first 5 serieswhat was once an ordinary trainer overcoming challenges and tough battles turned into special snowflake getting special forms for greninja and lycanroc, then getting meltan and poipoleactual special privileges are giving legendaries or a shiny broken mon that can mega evolve (like the new guy has)
>>59692035i bet you dilated a little too! tee hee!~
Ash has special aura powers...https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/AuraIn the Pokémon world's past, there were once humans who could sense aura and control its power. These humans, known as Aura Guardians, traveled around doing good deeds and passing on their skills to those who also possessed this innate ability. As featured in Lucario and the Mystery of Mew, one famous Aura Guardian was Sir Aaron of Rota, who took a Lucario as his apprentice and became a hero when he sacrificed himself to stop a war from destroying the area around the Tree of Beginning.The Aura Guardians disappeared from history, for some undisclosed reason, a long time before the present era. The only humans in the present time known to have the ability to control Aura are Riley and Ash Ketchum, though Ash has chosen to continue his journey as a Pokémon Trainer rather than follow up on the revelation. However, he did follow in the footsteps of both known Aura Guardians by helping Lucario save the Tree of Beginning and resealing Spiritomb.
>>59692048>Ash has special aura powers.Everybody on pokemon world has aura , not just Ash. Ash's aura has been irrelevant and only react when he is around special Lucario just like how Roy can use Aura because of shiny Lucario. Only difference is that Ash had to grow to understand aura while Roy understood aura by doing Hoge Hoge Hoge.
>>59692040Because these woke scumbags are spreading misinformation about Ash.
>>59690589This thread should become a general.
>>59692040>this is why the latter series started feeling bad compared to the first 5 series>what was once an ordinary trainer overcoming challenges and tough battles turned into special snowflake getting special forms for greninja and lycanroc, then getting meltan and poipoleWhich happen 20 years after Ash's journey started. If that supposed to be special privilege then what should we say about Roy who get Rayquaza handed to him despite all his development being offscreen ?
>>59692073It was a general once.It was called /ptsd/.
Remember this guy thinks Captain America Brave New World to be a solid movie. No wonder he insisted Pokemon Horizons to be good in the past.
>The only Hicklovers circlejerking each other are ESLs or can't shut up about "woke" unpromptedI don't know if I should laugh or get embarrassed by how haywired Ashqueermos became to keep the attention on themselves.
>>59692084Just call it Ashnime thread.
>>59685514>>59692087>zacktoshi.png>OP can't shut up about people he hates until they say something that strokes his SI ego>Didn't even watched the full video of the OP proving the point of >>59685602I don't know what's more embarrassing, the fact Fagmon is generally an homeless unhappy leech or the fact that people basically out themselves on an anonymous website multiple times.Also voting for the addition of country flag IDs to /vp/ as an test experiment.
>>59692101Wa wa wa , all you doing are crying and trolling because you never had any argument. Pokemon removed Ash just like you wanted and it only made matter worst yet your fragile ego still can not accept that you were wrong.
i dont know why ash haters antiash or whatever keep replying if you already won, he's never coming back btw
>>59692141Because they are betting on Pokemon executives being dumb & stupid that keep pushing dumb idea over & over. A smarter executive will just go with Ash, Brock travelling with a new girl on Gen 10 region after the disappointment of Horizons instead of betting another series on new OC. Its safer, riskfree and would generate better hype than anything Horizons has done. .
>>59692158theat are not dumb, dumbs are the poketroons still keep consooming their garbage, they prefer make a tcg movie for the 30 anniv because poketroons keep consooming cards
The anime is a flop in general lol 30 years and only 1% of revenue lmao
>>59692022Ash was a complete newbie on first season going up against trainers more experienced than himYou mean just like the players in the games, especially when the anime was first airing and no one knew how things worked yet?>gym leader's job is to test trainer (not winning battle) & he passed their test.Wrong. The point of gym leaders is to teach challengers how to synergize with their Pokemon, meaning teaching them to use the right 'mon for the job. That means you need to have the common sense to track down 'mons of the correct typing before charging in blindly, and raising them while tweaking your lineup so you understand how to efficiently use them - which is the real thing gym leaders are testing you on, plus it encourages you to fill out your Pokedex at the same time. Ash seemed to have an aversion to actually catching things, never modified his roster to fit the situation, and got his badges out of charity.>>59692040>they wanted ash to defeat onix with a single tackle and then catch mewtwo and rape the entire leagueAt what point did I say that? I wanted Ash to beat Onix the way I did - by making a team instead of relying on a single Pokemon, realizing that certain moves aren't going to be effective, and actually strategizing. I beat Onix in-game using a Butterfree, a Pidgey, a Rattata, and a Charmander, all by learning that I should be swapping 'mons, using healing potions, and figuring out what moves like Tail Whip and Growl did while NOT attacking when it's using Bide. Ash didn't strategize at all, and won by doing something that shouldn't have been possible (electricity can't actually set off fire sprinklers. In fact, a good jolt could fry the sensors, preventing them from working at all). He never learned anything, never adapted his strategies to deal with different situations, and didn't earn his badges (or half of his actual 'mons. He only legitimately caught Krabby, Caterpie, and some Tauros he never used).
Tranimefags think they can win against the games and tcg ahahahaha the anime always will be a irrelevant flop
>>59692209>You mean just like the players in the gamesProtagonist of the game is just bland slate for real player to self insert as them. It only works for the game not for the anime where protagonist has to be a character. >The point of gym leaders is to teach challengers how to synergize with their Pokemon, meaning teaching them to use the right 'mon for the job.Can you not shove your fanfic headcanon ? Gym leaders who handed their badge to Ash insisted that their job is to test the trainer and cheek if they are qualified for their badge and they gave their badge to Ash because they acknowledged him to be worthy. Not to mention that Ash still LOST the indigo League because writers acknowledge he didn't had enough development to win the league unlike Roy who didn't even had half the character development Ash had and magically strong enough to beat a freaking Rayquaza by doing Hoge Hoge Hoge. True Ashnime writer would never let Roy catch Rayquaza, they would have choose Nemona for it while Roy acknowledge his weakness in place of Uruto.
TCGchads won, wild card won,animekeks lost hard
>>59685514too girlyRoy should have been the protag
>>59692242Roy was the one killed the entire series.
>>59692229Why does your English get more and more broken with every post?
>>59692273his name is mavilla, he is a youtuber
Out of all the series, Pokemon Horizon required Ash the most. The whole plot of the series could have only worked with Ash & pushing his role to a newbie killed the series.
>>59692229>Can you not shove your fanfic headcanon ?That's not headcanon, that's literally their function in the game. There's a reason why, in most cases, you can find Pokemon that are either Super Effective against or resistant to the Gym Leader you're about to challenge in the immediate area around the city where the gym is - you go in, you read the statue at the entrance of the gym to get an idea of what Types the leader uses, than you backtrack to grab a 'mon to counter that (assuming you didn't already catch one on your way over). Then you grind them (and the rest of your team) to the appropriate level to challenge them, because if you're not around the same level as the current Gym Leader, then you'll be underleveled for the next Route/Dungeon that you'll be passing through afterwards. Gyms forced you to be constantly changing your roster, constantly catching and experimenting with new Pokemon, and constantly creating new strategies to best stringer and stronger opponents, and the badges (and story progression) were your reward for it - which is how it SHOULD have worked in the anime.Of course, this was before the games went from "common sense" to "mind-numbingly easy", and given the way you write, I'm assuming you're from a younger generation.
>>59692289That retard in question is over 35 and a hobo. You're wasting your time on an manchild who made a fictional child his identity.
>>59692289>, that's literally their function in the game.Game is not same as anime, Game supposed to be a self inserted wish fulfillment media while the anime has to follow the story. Game protagonist meant to be Mary sue, the anime protagonist are not.
>>59692327>Game is not same as animeThe anime was a commercial for the game, bro. That's the only reason it ever existed.>Game protagonist meant to be Mary sueYou have no idea what that word means.
>>59692398Doesn't mean the anime works same as the game. Do you know what Mary Sue means?
>>59692242Roy is dark skin, so no
>>59692538>Do you know what Mary Sue means?Yes, it's a character who is flawless and beloved by absolutely everyone around them, to the point where their presence drags down the plot - which is not at all how your player characters in the games are portrayed. What did YOU think the term meant, Mr. ESL?
Mary sue is just girl name
>>59692538>Doesn't mean the anime works same as the game.Which is a problem for something that exists to be an advertisement, dont'cha think?
>>59685514The only people who watched and cared about the anime were the ashfags once he was removed, they left.Newer generations find the Pokémon anime too cringey—especially with the Pokémon constantly repeating their own names.
>>59692656>Which is a problem for something that exists to be an advertisement,Not when they are trying to make an actual good anime and not some wish fulfillment fantasy like the game
He's not even using the term Mary Sue right.
>>59692689>Not when they are trying to make an actual good animeWell, they failed at that rather spectacularly, and managed to continue to fail at it for decades.>wish fulfillment fantasy like the gameWhat part of the games was wish fulfillment? I'm beginning to think you've never played a single one of them.
>>59692725> One of the most popular and iconic anime > Only video game adaptation that run nonstop for over 20 years > B-but it failed cause I said so. Funny how your entire arguments comes down to "I said so". >What part of the games was wish fulfillment?The entire thing. A kid who start with a level 05 starter start defeating gym leader & reach all the way to champions within few days despite almost of them has years of battling experience & honed their skill while also single-handily take down evil organization that the region's law enforcement could not & catches all the special & strongest pokemon of the region, this is just a self inserted wish fulfillment story. The entire story with Kieran showcase how the world in the game bends to the player no matter how hard NPC tries to catch up.
>>59692645Feminists gets angry when people use Mary Sue to describe only females.
>>59692750>A kid who start with a level 05 starter start defeating gym leader & reach all the way to champions within few days despite almost of them has years of battling experience & honed their skill while also single-handily take down evil organization that the region's law enforcement could not & catches all the special & strongest pokemon of the region, this is just a self inserted wish fulfillment story.Where to even begin with this? You don't just beat the gym leaders and reach Champion rank instantly - you have to work for it. There's a million other things you have to do first to even get yourself into a position where you're strong enough to challenge the leaders, and then you still have to earn your victories. That's not wish fulfillment, that's pretty much how life in general works - you work at something, you overcome obstacles, you advance. Second, it doesn't take "a few days". There's no day/night cycle in RGBY, but it's implied you're traveling for months or longer, and in GSC where there IS a day/night cycle, you can literally see the passage of time. Either way, a several-month-to-a-year-long journey is plenty of time to learn how to beat a bunch of gym leaders - and in-universe it's expected that kids will be able to do so. Third: the evil organization subplots of the games are just your standard fare shounen anime tropes...which is what your beloved anime already has and uses in spades, so if you're using that as an argument about "wish fulfillment", then the same can be said about the anime.Catching all the legendaries is implied to be noncanon, given even the ones who are supposed to be unique individuals show up in the following games as well - but you'd know that if you actually played the games.Seems to me like you're just talking out of your ass here and have no idea what you're saying - especially since you seem to be using the anime as your own actual wish fulfillment by inserting yourself as Ash.
>>59692892It's a female only term, though. The male equivalent is a Gary Stu.Also, fuck 4chan for considering that to be spam.
>>59692939>you have to work for it.If anybody else doesn't, only the protagonist ever does. Messi didn't instantly become good enough to win World Cup when he was 10 , he was close to retirement when he won it. Realistically a trainer with level 05 won't reach the level of gym leaders within a week. It will take month and Years for them reach their level but that doesn't happen in the game , isn't it?Same goes with evil organisations, how the heck a 10 year old can take out an entire organisation all by themselves but the police can't? Catching the legendary pokemon is also part of the game. All Pokémon are only for the player. Even if the pokemon choose somebody else like Neddy, the game will find an excuse to hand it over to the players. Even killing off AZ just so player could get his Floette.The game is just wish fulfillment.
>>59693254The exact same argument can be made about the anime. Ash himself is only 10 (perpetually), remember?Just wish fulfillment.
>>59692081that's exactly what i saidearly pokemon anime actually felt good because it didn't treat the mc like some special chosen one who gets rare pokemon and shitthe moment they started giving him special privileges like ash greninja, dusk form lycanroc, meltan, poipole, the series started going to shitand now the new guy literally has shiny mega evolution and legendariesit just feels off putting
>>59693308Except in anime, characters doesn't age. We know for sure that one year passed during Johto Journey and Ash still nowhere near a champion. Each League Conference are yearly which means one year has to passed with each League Ash completed. Ilima also competed on Kalos league but didn't met Ash so there are two year gap between XY&Z and SM series. Burnet had her baby on JN which means one year gap between SM and JN series.Compared to that, how many days players takes to be champion.
>>59693505>Compared to that, how many days players takes to be champion.Depends. If it's a literal 10-year-old playing the game for the first time, they might not ever even reach the League before quitting. A 35-year-old who takes things too seriously, on the other hand, could reach the League in a matter of hours. And like you said - Ash doesn't age in the anime, meaning a 10-year-old boy managed to travel the world, take on multiple gyms in multiple countries, meet multiple Legendaries and Mythicals, participate in (and lose) multiple League challenges, and foil multiple plots by multiple baddies all in just a few months. That seems a whole lot worse than your reasoning for the timeline in the games.>We know for sure that one year passed during Johto Journey>Each League Conference are yearly which means one year has to passed with each League Ash completed>there are two year gap between XY&Z and SM seriesNope. Doesn't matter. Ash is officially, canonically 10 years old through the whole series, and thus all of his accomplishments take place in under a single year. You don't get to headcanon that the events of the games only take a few days because that's how long it takes an autistic manchild who already knows what to do and where to go to complete it in real-time while pretending the anime takes place over the course of several years when the official word is that Ash didn't age and thus time didn't pass.
