>villain is irredeemableWhy does this simple concept mindbreak western audiences so badly?
I can't believe weebs tricked me into this boring ass slice of life shit
>>224033306Jews
>>224033400They have nothing else going for them. Atm they're all Malfoid posting now
But what if a demon was raised by loving human parents? Surely those human qualities would rub off onto the demon.
>>224033306It doesn't, it's literally the fucking opposite, you retarded weeaboo faggot. It was anime that introduced those complicated villains with le sad past to Western pop-culture.
>>224033306I don't like the idea of someone being CONCEPTUALLY irredeemable. It's what you do that decides your morality, not your birth.
>>224033470In fact, this was the biggest difference between Western and Eastern media for children. Western media - bad guy is ugly and evil, but usually very crafty - pretty much every Disney movie Eastern meia - bad guy looks exactly like the protagonist and has some sad past that made him crazy (every other villain in Sailor Moon). Or bad guys becomes a good guy (almost every villain in Dragon Ball pre-Frieza).
>>224033306stop reading xenophobic manga chud
>>224033519>bad guy looks exactly like the protagonist and has some sad past that made him crazyMazinger Z was not like that
>>224033306liberals maybe, regular people can roll with it
Why are demons bad anyways if it's just for their own sake- pure evil? That sounds like lazy writing
>>224033519>Western and EasternI know it basically means the world and Japan, but I wonder which side Finland belongs to
What are you talking about?
>>224033527>Let the demonic space dragon devour your planet, you heckin' chud!No.
>>224033306>Why does this simple concept mindbreak western audiences so badly?Because they're demons wearing human skin.
>>224033690is that staff going in her pussy and out her butthole?
>>224033306>le sasuke forgiven after "yeah... sorry"you stupid weebos have no right to ask this question, fuck off
>>224033469Correct. Purely socioeconomic factors.
>>224033306It's just usually more interesting to see a complex evil villain. Irredeemable villains - which simplify the story - tend to belong to media geared towards those of young emotional age (or are stunted emotionally), as they are the audiences that find this material the most engaging.
>>224033306Because it doesnt really reflect reality, unless the villain is/represents like a storm or a poison or something else inhuman.
>>224033746N-No...
>>224033306Christianity
>>224033306Women hate finality and the inability to have your cake and eat it too.Which is why they hate the idea of virginity being something good etc.
>>224033519which is funny because the disney villains, frieza and homelander are all inconic characters while nobody remembers villains with a dark sad past lmao
>>224033519Sailor Moon had the absolute best villains in all of anime and is pretty much the gold standard for how to pull that kind of thing off. What makes it great is that it isn't done in such a way where it's like "x villain has a sad past, therefore you should feel sorry for them in spite of all the horrible shit they're doing" or whatever, rather each of them have unique and compelling motivations to be doing what they're doing, while the protagonists likewise have absolutely reasonable justification to oppose them anyway.>>224035426That's only because, for various reasons, DBZ and the like remained popular consistently and the dubbing is seen as either good enough or outright more iconic, while very few westerners have even seen a 'proper' version of Sailor Moon that handled the villains appropriately.
>watch frieren>pretty good show, but didn't like the tournament arc>check what others think online>FREIREN IS A NAZIwhat causes this
>>224033306Unless he's a nazi then he should be tortured and killed
>>224035885>what causes thisshe is literally an eco-fascist. so i'm okay with it.
>HUMANS LE POWER HUMANS THE STRONGEST HUMANITY MEANS HUMANS THE BEST LIVING ORGANISM IN THE ENTIRE GALAXY FUCK YEAH Why does this stupid concept so beloved by tranime audience?
>>224035923what
>>224035885Leftists are literal demons.
>>224035959I'm assuming you're not aware fascists were environmentalists?
>>224035965what makes frieren one
>>224035967I have no idea, never even seen the show.
>>224033306The Western pagan spirit consists in the extension of humanity to all beings. It's why white people are uniquely fixated on animal rights and environmentalism.To the average Western white person, the destruction of a forest is the literal slaughter of a disembodied conscious person that resembles human beings.It's also why Western white people are the most prone to debating whether or not AI has personhood.These same people are also the most likely to personify Capitalism as a kind of superhuman entity.>I know I'm redeemable, so this thing that's like me must be redeemable. In other words, Western white people see similarities everywhere.The Japanese Shinto spirit consists in the extension of a spiritual consciousness to objects which have their own unique and respectable consciousnesses, but these are fundamentally inhuman and therefore don't receive the save reverence. >I know I'm redeemable, but this thing is nothing like me, so why should I assume that it is?In other words, East Asian people see difference.
audiences?
>>224035959Frieren is literally an eco-fascist.>obsessed with preserving knowledge, specifically ancient/esoteric knowledge >obsessed with the natural order of relationships for better or worst (ensuring her adopted daughter finds a mate, ensuring demons die)You're not a demon are you?
>>224035885I've seen more posts complaining about people calling her a Nazi than posts calling her a Nazi
>>224036003japanese thought unfortunately is thoroughly permeated by western thought. The Frieren demons are an exception. Usually you see anime and manga protagonists trying to find the good in the enemy even at great cost and most of the time they manage to convert the bad to good instead of failing and reaping horrible consequences
>>224036068>Usually you see anime and manga protagonists trying to find the good in the enemy even at great cost and most of the time they manage to convert the bad to good>>224033519 correctly explained that this is how it normally always was, as Japanese are highly empathetic and willing to go beyond the black and white thinking which is much more characteristic of the morality of western media, as opposed to a reversal where the Nipponese have been 'corrupted' by the apparant open mindedness of western thought.
>>224036090With Demons you can't reason.
>>224036068This is just a superficial adoption of western culture for storytelling purposes. Japan is still a hellish place to be a criminal or anyone with a delinquent past.
>>224036066i've seen the opposite. what now?
>>224036113one of us is lying.
>>224036120i agree.
>>224036090nah, jap morality is demonic. they will tell you murdering entire continents of people is kind of ok and forgivable actually. western morality presenting the one who does that as pure evil is more morally accurate. your own post is proof of that. you legit cant tell good from evil of it isnt bashed into you with a sledgehammer
>>224035961trump literally rapes children.
>>224036140>meanwhile reality:
>>224036106And Japanese media is refreshing precisely because of how willing it is to admit the 'demonic' nature of the way most people actually think.Look at the original Megami Tensei OVA for a good example of this, the protagonist initially does heinous shit, but the narrative perspective sides with him and ultimately lets him be the hero regardless, in way way naturally portraying how people habitually ignore all their evil and ultimately excusing that to go on and live as if nothing like that had transpired.
>>224036159KEK this was their VP nominee btw. actual literal demons o algo.
>>224036159how does this disproves trump raping children?
>>224036159lmao
>>224036090>Japanese are highly empathetic and willing to go beyond the black and white thinkingIt's not really a "going beyond" when they never had this moral dualism to begin with.
>>224036174it doesn't. it points out that democrats are as guilty of diddling kids if not more. it's just that as opposed to that anon you don't have any proof.
>murders countless people in his sleep with Freddy Krueger powers granted to him by a dream demon>gets redeemed anyway
>>224036159>"LE HECKING EPSTEIN CLASS CHILD RAPISTS!!!!!1!!">is an actual pedophile every single time kek
>>224036188>proof>shitter threadlol. LMAO. KEK.you are going to hell when you die for supporting trump, you know that right? the trump who rapes children and stole money from kids with cancer? this is the man you support. this is why your soul will be without God for eternity.
>>224036140You are mistaking him for Iranian.
>>224036159
In a typical Japanese story it would turn out that the demons were the good guys and that the elf girl is a demon herself.
>>224036132Lol I just pretty much the same point >>224036165 but from the opposite perspective"You legit cant tell good from evil of it isn't bashed into you with a sledgehammer" is a very Christian perspective, any honestly moral person will be capable of judging their own actions through recognizing their potential harm to others. At the same time, violent exercise of power is necessary to prevent other's fro doing the same against you, and pacifists will always fail to do ultimate good in the face of opposing enemies.
>>224036159another illegal somalian child rapist (read: democrat) got deported? based
>>224036165>precisely because of how willing it is to admit the 'demonic' nature of the way most people actually think.That's not what Frieren is doing though. The Demons aren't 'most people', they're a different species entirely with different behavioral standards.Chuds like Frieren because they take this depiction and assume it's representing a realm of cosmically evil beings that must be destroyed, i.e. the Christian Hell.
>>224036207>this is why your soul will be without God for eternity.You are athiest.
>>224033306>who is Sephiroth >who is Guts
>>224036231Frieren just lives in a world like that though. I says nothing about how we ought to treat other humans.
>>224036235lmao, stop trying to steer away the argument. you support an evil man, and your soul will never feel God's love after you die.
>>224036239>who is SephirothA character who had real merit and virtue, but who was corrupted into being an enemy of humanity (though, initially this occurred because he was duped into mistakenly thinking he was from a race that was oppressed and neigh destroyed).
>>224036259>you support an evil manI don't support Aishatollah.
>>224036159i voted for this
>>224036304just cut to the end and kill yourself. you'll be in hell either way.
>>224036298well I was being short hand, Shinra is the villain
>>224036127>>224033690Vampire princess Miyu would have made a good ICE agent.
>>224036231Frieren is a 2k+ year old creature who has only had the idea reinforced over and over again that Demons are evil.It's not projection, it's their world's mythology.Demons do not feel, they mimic.Just like certain groups of humanoids do IRL.
>>224036140Bold claim. I'm assuming you must have some pretty extraordinary proof for that extraordinary claim, right? But that begs the question as to why you haven't taken such a bombshell to the media or anything like that.
>>224036159Daily reminder that this guy is also neck-deep in Somalian Fraud that stole literal BILLIONS from the American Taxpayer.And Democrats unironically wanted this crooked cuck to be VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES...
>>224036335demon, get killed by the foot elf
Is this a zoomer thing or something? This general lack of knowledge and media illiteracy?
>>224033469the show addresses this in season 1, eventually the kid just snaps. they're like pit bulls.
>Durrrrr Americans can't handle morally gray characters! Every character has to be simple and 'good' or 'evil' like in Lord of the Rings!>Durrrrr Americans can't handle morally pure characters that are simply 'good' or 'evil'! Every character has to be morally gray!Can the America-obsessed retards out there AT LEAST get their narratives straight? I know it's too much to ask you to actually be logical or honest, but at the very least can you just make sure that the narratives you push are, if nothing else, NOT in constant, direct contradiction to each other?Fucking get together and compare your fucking memos or something; make sure you've all received the SAME, most up-to-date marching-orders.
>>224033306I watched the first 6 or 7 episodes before giving up, does this shit get any better or did i make the right call?
>>224033306It's funny how "some" people got offended at the demons in Frieren, calling their portrayal antisemitic.
>>224036174>prove a negativeWe're still waiting on proof that Trump; or any of your other various boogeymen, honestly; "rapes children".
because the west is the evil villain
>>224033519>Western media - bad guy is ugly and evil>pretty much every Disney movie???
>>224036528Gaston is a caricature. He doesn't have the main character look.
>>224036451Both are true though.Americans default to:-There is clear good and evil, and certain characters may be more or less pure or impure and corrupt or possibly forced to do evil, but ultimately you can see and judge the character's actions and see how close to real goodness they are. This also applies to 'edgy' shit because, that stuff knows that it's supposed to be 'bad' and hence affirms the moral worldview it's apparently rebelling against.Jap shit is better because it less frequently defaults to to the idea that "everything is good vs evil, or otherwise a corrupted grey" and instead has a more fluid understanding that characters have individual reasons for believing and acting as they do, and accepts that as what it is without having some ultimate, foreign standard for what's supposed to be 'truly good' but is really some hyper specific traditions handed down from a bunch of desert people who folded into an empire. The flip-side as that you're also more free to hate an individual character based on your own personal judgement as much as you are to suspend that judgement, rather than feeling like the media is forcing you into some implicitly subscribed Abramahic value set.
>>224036564>NPCs literally cannot determine instinctively that something is good or evil>they must use their NPC check system to find some morally grey areait's insane that people think americans are evil when you have people this soulless in the world.
>>224036504just kill yourself
>>224036389It's not really clear if the Frieren Demons are evil or just a different species with different values, though. Western Demons are explicitly evil. They know they are doing wicked deeds and enjoy doing them.
>>224036597No it is clear.If I came across a race of people who completely lacked empathy, as in they could not process empathy in any capacity.They would by default be evil.Stop trying to find morally grey where it doesn't exist.Humans have empathy, it can be a fucked up sense of empathy, but it exist.
>>224036528Gaton is very obviously wrong and ego driven and deludes people into following him through sophistry rather than seeking understanding. You can substitute 'vain' for outright 'ugly' and get the same thing. Not all Disney villains are the same level of ugly, but all of them are corrupt or distorted in some way.
>>224033400>he trusted weebs to give him kinolmao
>>224033306Nah, western audiences love irredeemable villains, especially if the villain is white Christian (or white Christian-coded in a fantasy world). What they sperg so much about is the concept of a villain who is born evil (which is NOT the same as irredeemable), which the OP picture seems to be about.
>>224036618It's really not that clear. A person incapable of empathy might not ever carry out an action that's harmful to someone else. Most people are some kind of consequentialist so to most people, nothing about that situation is immoral. It really comes down to whether or not Demons are some kind of manifestation of evilness itself or chaos itself rather than just a different species. If you gave most spiders a human form they wouldn't act dissimilarly from the demons but we don't see spiders as intrinsically evil.
>>224033519>Western media - bad guy is ugly and evilThe moral of "beauty is only skin-deep", i.e. "appearance is disconnected from morality", is not only one of the most common morals presented in Western media (any story that HAS a "moral", at least), but it's SO common that people outright complain that it is "overused" and "cliche" at this point. This is even true of Disney movies, which you even name for your example.The entire moral of their version of Beauty & the Beast and The Hunchback of Notre Dame is "Don't judge people by their appearance, as appearance is disconnected from morality". Pocahontas even extends this to a real-world, societal level with the moral being "Don't judge people or even other cultures based on the fact that they LOOK or SEEM different from you, as you may have much in common".That's not even a relatively "recent" trend for Disney movies. Even their very first feature-length animated movie and their first real big cultural hit, Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs, which came out back in 19-fucking-37, defies your claim about Disney movies & Western media in general: Despite the protagonist obviously being "beautiful" to the point where it's a literal plot-point in the original fairy tale, the villainous Queen in that movie is portrayed as being very traditionally "beautiful" as well. In fact, she only becomes "ugly" as part of donning a disguise in order to deceive the protagonists. Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs is about as "basic bitch" as you can get as far as both Disney movies and morals in Western media, and even that is an exception to your claimed "rule".It sounds more to me like you're not even that familiar with Western media, and your knowledge of it is instead based on assumptions and stereotypes.
>>224036564>Jap shit is better because it less frequently defaults to to the idea that "everything is good vs evil, or otherwise a corrupted grey" and instead has a more fluid understanding that characters have individual reasons for believing and acting as they do, and accepts that as what it is without having some ultimate, foreign standard for what's supposed to be 'truly good' but is really some hyper specific traditions handed down from a bunch of desert people who folded into an empire.I don't understand what about this is supposed to be better.
>>224036676>but we don't see spiders as intrinsically evil.not that guy, but I do, and I'm right.
The real kino is>the hero is irredeemable
>>224033306Go back to /a/
>>224036676You seem to be confused.Demons in Frieren literally do not have empathy or love.You seem to be confused specifically on the idea of mutual gain and strength in numbers.While this can seem like empathy, empathy very specifically requires caring about the other party.Which demons don't care, they have no empathy. So they are evil and yes any species that has zero empathy would also be called evil.>b-but muh spidersspiders are robots, they have no emotions whatsoever. your comparison is not appropriate.Demons in Frieren have emotions, they feel anger, greed, love of self.They specifically lack empathy or love of others.So they are evil.
>>224033306This quote is popular because it describes and depicts the tactics of leftists perfectly. It has nothing to do with how irredeemable demons are in the story. Western media is full of irredeemable bad guys.
>>224036564>Americans are wrong no matter WHAT they do. If they do [A], then I assume it's [A] to such an absurd extreme that it becomes "wrong". If they do [B], then I assume it's [B] to such an absurd extreme that it becomes "wrong". So now I can accuse them of being "wrong", regardless of what they do!Yes, third-worlder, we know: This kind of Morton's Fork anti-logic is common among you faggots. That's because you don't argue logically; you START with your conclusion that "Americans = bad", and then just kind of work your way backwards to justifying that with an engineered "argument".
>>224036587Well you certainly sound like someone who has a genuine, valid argument to present, and a mentally-healthy individual overall!
>>224036715hahahah
>>224036723go back to /pol/
>>224036624>Gaton is very obviously wrong and ego driven and deludes people into following him through sophistry rather than seeking understanding.You said NOTHING about that. You said NOTHING about the bad guy's actual character. No shit the villain of the story does bad things.You said:>Western media, pretty much every Disney movie - bad guy is ugly and evilGaston, however, is not only presented as being traditionally attractive, but he's treated as traditionally attractive in-universe with him being the town's most desirable heartthrob among the women there.This means your conjecture was incorrect, or at the very LEAST a main-line and very popular example of the kind of media you outright named is a direct exception to your conjecture. That's all.
>>224036764the idiot you're responding to blatantly wrong.Gaston is the good guy, it's objective.Beast was literally cursed with being as ugly on the outside as he was on the inside. So it checks out for a Disney movie.The entire movie is how women will always choose to join evil.
>>224036059how is that fascist
>>224036536Are you kidding me? Yes he does. He would look entirely in-place in some narrative about him riding through the 17th-Century European countryside and hunting-down vampires and other monsters that menace the populace....And now that I mention it, I would absolutely watch the shit out of a movie or miniseries like that.
>>224036722If you see morality as ultimately concerned with doing good deeds then a lack of empathy doesn't necessarily imply immorality. A person might be defective in a way that inclines them to immoral behavior but that's not the same as saying they are immoral. If you believe evilness is some kind of force in the world enabling bad things to happen then it's also not necessarily the case that a person without empathy is more evil, even if they're more likely to be an agent of evil.And even if you want to say people without empathy are definitely evil, then they're still a lesser kind of evil compared with the traditional Western Demon which is pure evil incarnate and actively promotes the dissolution of all goodness to wage cosmic war against God.>They specifically lack empathy or love of others. So they are evil.Repeating yourself doesn't constitute a proof.
>>224036624>bad guy is ugly because he's evil>"Well actually Gaston's evil, which we see in his actions!"Lol, no shit, retard? That wasn't the claim being contradicted. The claim was that "the bad guy is always ugly"; implying that this is supposedly "necessary" in Western media in order to "not confuse" the audience or something; when Gaston is the bad guy but portrayed as being very traditionally attractive and even initially likable.
>>224036689It's a meme. Visually you can immediately tell if the characters is good or evil in Disney movies. Frolo is ugly, Jafar is ugly, Ursula is ugly, Scar is ugly and so on. Main characters are always handsome, boyish and drawn in a somewhat realistic style. For anime there's often little difference between the appearence of villains and heroes. They are both pretty boys or pretty girls.
>>224036798We are talking here about Disney. Gaston looks nothing like a Disney prince. In fact, he doesn't look like a protagonist in any media, unless the protagonist is a conceited moron.
>>224035961That's from Netflix's Devil May Cry series, isn't it.Holy fuck. And to think that at one point I thought I couldn't hate them any MORE than I already did after what they did to the Castlevania IP.That shit is something that a rightwinger would literally MAKE UP as a joking prediction as to the kind of slop Netflix would write. And Netflix went and did it unironically. Fucking mind-blowing.
>>224033306Because making the irredeemable hellspawn a misunderstood dindunuffin is how certain groups virtuesignal, increase social standing and claim virtual land.
>>224036822It's not about Western media as a whole, but Western media for children.
>>224036788>wanting to genocide an entire species in a authoritarian manner suddenly isn't fascistanon c'mon>>224036808>doesn't imply immoralityit does, you can cope however you need to, but to be moral you must be able to empathize.Frieren does empathize with the demons, but comes to the conclusion they cannot change because they lack empathy. For all evidence we have she is correct.The demons, lacking empathy altogether cannot be moral. You still seem to be very confused m8.Edmund Kemper turned himself over to the police for murdering multiple women, seems moral right? Doesn't change the fact he is objectively an evil man.You seem to be under some strange belief that once you cross a line, you can still be considered good.Well i'm here to tell you, you're wrong.You can keep posting if you want to keep posting, but bro you aren't going to convince me that someone who lacks the ability to care for something else is anything, but evil.Having humanity requires empathy, if you do not have humanity you are a lesser beast.
>>224036764I'm not even the other due you were arguing against, but the pattern holds true in general even if there are superficial exceptions. Like, Ursula is the only major, serious villain I can think of who's an outright fat bitch, the others are mostly corrupted, mean looking and/or lacking the youth they used to have etc. having the visage of someone deeply jealous and angry and unheroic, but usually not outright horrid looking for their age/circumstance.The point is that they exist in a state where they clearly play the role of the designated the villain that they are, and couldn't be mistaken for or swapped with the hero if things were taken from a different point of view. This is why all those "what if the villain was really a hero" alternate takes on them completely change everything so that the former villain is now 'actually good' and innocent and the hero instead the twisted and corrupt one, instead of actually portraying the same events from a different perspective. Because there's no room for that otherwise.
>>224036808winner for most jewish post on /tv/.
>>224036886>killing people who want to kill you is fascist
>>224033400It's funny because what people disliked the most about this anime was the excessive number of the fights
>>224036856It's the same situation as the Starship Troopers bugs, they see themselves in the bugs/demons and can't help but empathize with them. Presenting demons as irredeemable monsters whose very nature drives them to hurt and kill humans makes them go "Wait, this feels racist" for some reason. The idea of a group of creatures being inherently bad, predatory, or destructive goes against the "everyone is good, we're all the same uwu" nonsense they love.
>>224036886>but to be moral you must be able to empathizeWhy? As I said, if you accept consequentialism as an ethical system, then it's at least plausible a being without empathy could learn moral rules and abide by them, even if for purely self-interested reasons. You can make a similar argument for deontological ethics. Your argument hinges on ethics being a kind of virtue.>The demons, lacking empathy altogether cannot be moral.Amoral =/= immoral.>Doesn't change the fact he is objectively an evil manBecause of the consequences of his actions, because of his innate lack of empathy, because of a mix of the two, because of something else? Can you start to see why this isn't as simple as you want it to be?>Having humanity requires empathy, if you do not have humanity you are a lesser beastBeasts aren't evil though.
>>224036707my most dangerous geist...
>>224036846I honestly think that you are letting Gaston's actual character and his portrayal in the movie (which you have likely been fully familiar with since your formative years if you're in even remotely the same age-demographic as I am) color your perception and interpretation of just his appearance. Keep in mind that "appearance" is just what somebody LOOKS like, completely removed from their actual behavior or portrayal in a piece of fiction.And in that regard, yes, Gaston 100% LOOKS like he'd be the protagonist of a more traditional narrative. He looks like the kind of guy you would pick to go out and fight the Headless Horseman or kill a Vampire Count that has been menacing a village: Tall, handsome, muscular, manly, traditionally attractive to women, Chad-jawline, confident stare, implied cockiness and wilyness/cunning, etc. He's even wearing bold red, i.e. "the Protagonist's Color". He looks like the hero from some OTHER fairy tale.And that was 100% intentional on Disney's part: Gaston is MEANT to at least initially fit this archetype, but have it be revealed that he has a brutal and unsympathetic nature rather than an actually heroic one Because that's part of Beauty & the Beast's entire point: To be an inversion of that more typical narrative, with a monstrous-looking character that is revealed to be sympathetic and heroic, and a heroic-looking character that is revealed to be unsympathetic and monstrous. That is part of HOW it presents it's moral that "appearances are only skin-deep".
>>224036903I don't see what my Jewishness has to do with the conversation. Everything I'm saying is pretty standard for Western discourse on morality and ethics. If we accept that evil exists as more than a mere privation of good, then an entity which is evil incarnate is categorically different from an entity which simply lacks empathy. Even if you think empathy is a precondition for moral conduct.
>>224036846Gaston doesn't LOOK "vain" or "stupid". He just eventually BEHAVES in a way that reveals he's both self-obsessed and a moron.
>>224036847>That shit is something that a rightwinger would literally MAKE UP as a joking prediction as to the kind of slop Netflix would writeIt absolutely looks like a false flag that's ultimately trying to make American troops look justified (by implying that anything against them is shitting on them for fighting literal demons) rather than anything by some one who's honest anti-military.
>>224036963There are essentially just two body plans for villains in Disney 90s movies: strongman brick - Gaston, Radcliffe, Shan Yu and Clayton skinny snake - Jafar, Scar, Frollo, Hades None of them have main character look.
>>224036827>Frolo is uglyHe's perhaps not "traditionally attractive", but he doesn't really qualify as "ugly" either. Perhaps "intimidating", but not "repulsive".He's also not MEANT to be attractive in the traditional sense. The desirable trait that is implied by his appearance (but later revealed by the narrative to be fasle) is instead that he's "stately, moral, respectable, judicious, wise, honorable, respected, of high social status", etc. All things that are EXACTLY what you'd look for in someone serving as a Judge.Additionally, while maybe not "MOST women", I also know at least MANY women that went outright balk in disagreement at the claim that Frolo, or men like him, are "ugly".
>>224036978(You)
>>224033400watch made in abyss
>>224037061>The desirable trait that is implied by his appearance (but later revealed by the narrative to be fasle)He's obviously the villain from the very first scene. In the very opening he attempts to kill a newborn baby by throwing it to a well.
>>224033306the millennial and particularly the leftist is obsessed with subversion. they have programmed themselves to relate to the bad guys as a natural consequence of years of subversive media. they have been doing this for so long they cannot even comprehend stories where the bad guys are simply a force of ontological evil. it upsets and frustrates them because it is moral system with clearly drawn lines between good and evil instead of a sea of grey or a complete inversion of good and bad
>>224033306Leftists felt called out by a depiction of evil people that have no morals or principles and will say whatever they think will give them an advantage in a given moment
>>224037132Sorry I'm not a pedophile
>>224037195You've programmed yourself to believe all the lies of the bad guys, guzzles all their shitty slop, then shout to the heavens that they are actually the good guys. You'll make any excuse and jump through any hoops to justify that their actions aren't bad but actually good even in the face of clear, blatant evidence that makes you look like an insane clown for what you're saying. You'll say other people were bad for X thing they did, then justify away the thing your guy did that was 100x worse. It's now good because...well JUST BECAUSE! You aren't any better than the people you rant and rave about.
>>224037470didn't read this cope
>>224037470You don't know the first thing about me. Your knee jerk reaction to peg me into your carefully constructed strawman just goes to show you are incapable of nuance (a sign of the low IQ).We are talking about frieren, where the good guys are simply the good guys and bad guys are the bad guys and there is no room for your media literacy or mental gymnastics.
>>224037195I think you're conflating the average leftist person with some kind of postmodern stereotype. Most leftists believe in progress and a definite good and evil but they see things like capitalism on the wrong side of that divide.
the only good anime I've seen in the last ten years was that unironic faggots ice skating one.
>>224036737Go back tranny
>>224033306Because every villain as to be sympathetic and relatable (except if he's a Nazi or Christian) o algo
>>224037195Frieren is a subversion actually.Sauron chose to be evil. The orcs were corrupted nature and undead, raised on purpose to be evil. in the end, good could not destroy evil, evil destroyed itself and not a single soul in lotr was uncorruptable. Demons in frieren are amoral psychopaths with destructive instincts. Essentially an animal with a human's intellect. To declare them a threat is justfied. To exterminate them is to say every animal should be exterminated and that is the case until frieren can prove they were a creation from evil something actually abhorrent to nature.
>>224033306Westerners invented that trope. Case in point: >>224033627
>>224037931>not a single soul in lotr was uncorruptableBombadil>>224037415This.
Stick to anime and video games kids
>>224038598what about starship troopers
>>224036449The demon child didn't snap. Before being 'adopted' by the village chief, the demon girl had eaten the daughter of one of the other villagers.One night the demon killed the chief and presented his daughter to the couple whomst daughter she had ate, to make amends.In the shows universe, demons are all autistic as fuck regarding emotions.
>>224033400Yeah, it sucks ass.
>>224036460It starts slow but then gets more interesting and intense. Watch until after they get through the 1st class mage test.
>>224033746You should look at some pictures of vaginas and female reproductive anatomy
>>224036788To humans in modern times, anything that doesn't allow them to worship the self makes them angry, violently so. This is why all these political "upheavals" involve a bunch of people running around stealing shit. Even if they were initiated by actual idealists, for every 1 human that has empathy circuits and civilized organizational skills, there are literally dozens of thousands of idiotic animal brained morons.
It's a standard fantasy slop. If you want something actually good watch Mushishi.
>>224036947Without empathy you cannot guarantee morality, because empathy will allow morality in unaccounted situations. If someone is psychopathic for example, but trained to imitate and enact all "moral behaviors". The second they encounter something they have not encountered before, they will need to use their OWN creative process. If their OWN creative process lacks empathy, how can they possibly be moral? If you genuinely don't understand emotions and how things are affected, how could you judge what is good or had for something outside of your life? Why would you even care, if you literally don't have the thing that catalyze understanding emptions in others?
>>224033923>It's just usually more interesting to see a complex evil villainWhy?People claim this as if it's self evident but it's actually not. What makes a tragic backstory more interesting than a triumphalist one?
>>224037931This the conclusion I've reached on my own Psychopaths and sociopaths are no different than wolves, or praying mantises. They're just another form of predator. Obviously if you gave Wasps space age technology, they'd fucking kill everything while buzzing maniacally. Conversely, if you Gabe dung beetles technology, they'd likely INCREASE the efficacy of natures self-sustaining system >>224038506I think he's meant to represent a fundamental energy in nature, so I don't know if "soul" applies to him. If it did, you'd likely need to imagine the "Grim Reaper" as having a soul, or "Luck" having a soul.
>>224037132that's for pedophiles, unironically. The mangaka is a pedophile and very open about it
>>224039010>if you Gave dung beetles technology, they'd likely INCREASE the efficacy of natures self-sustaining systemWe already did that and it's a planet-wide disaster. Indians are spreading their disgusting filth everywhere.
>>224039070Honestly I think worse than psychopaths are these kinds of "trickster" types. A psychopaths is dangerous, but that doesn't inherently mean they'll use lies or deception A trickster, however, is the worst thing for public trust. The kind of person who feels that as long as you stop talking, that makes them right. The kind of person who wants your point to be unreceived not because it's wrong, but because of how it makes them feel. The kind of person who never answers questions directlyThe kind of person who, in times of danger, demand help, and in times of safety, find a way to give no aidPeople without empathy can maybe be worked with if they value order. People who value lying must only live in nature.
>>224039139
>>224033527>The Muslims were living in harmonyOut of the 10 worst and largest slave bearing empires in all of human history, 7 of them were and still are Islamic.Who are we even trying to kid any more.
>>224036676If you have a friend who's a recovering alcoholic, you don't take him to a bar. If someone you know has low empath, you keep their interactions woth normal people to an absolute minimum, if for no one else's sake, then at least their own.
>>224036451>Durrrrr Americans can't handle morally gray characters! Every character has to be simple and 'good' or 'evil' like in Lord of the Rings!No one has ever said this. LOTR was written by a Brit. Retard
>>224039826it's not even accurate to lord of the rings. The two main villains, gollum and sauron were not originally evil. gollum notably struggles with his evil and wants to be good at times
>>224033306I mean look at Israel.
>>224033400the first 3-4 episodes are VERY good and then it just becomes generic slop for some reason. the entirety of season 2 was just more hyper-formulaic slop.
>>224040061>gollum notably struggles with his evil and wants to be good at timesno that's smeagol, gollum is ice cold. if they weren't friends gollum would probably have killed smeagol.
>>224040169season 2 was so bad I think future viewers can probably skip it and not miss anything.
>>224039745extremely cringe image
>>224040214nobody likes annoying faggots who argue semantics anon.
>>224036211Seems a reasonable take to me.
>>224033498What about jews thou?
>>224040271Kvetch harder
>>224040338if you convince the person you raped to marry you then your rape obviously wasn't bad
>>224040449nobody gets persecuted for 2000 years without being evil.
>>224033469They're natural psychopaths. No amount of good parenting can instill empathy in them. They simply lack that capability.The most you could accomplish is making them a high functioning psychopath who only kills people when they can get away with it.
>>224036707I’m old and I had the tape back in the day. >originally was regarded as a masterpiece for anime >then got called edgy trash >recently people recognize it for what it is edgy trash (good) I’ve always lived MDG.
>>224040753>I’ve always lived MDG.What an odd post. I've only seen one anime this year (frieren) but I founded an anime club in the 90's and saw some mdg on VHS and I never saw the appeal it was never on my list of priorities.
>>224033306trump had a good reason to rape those kids... he just did
>>224036930I mean yeah, that's how it worked in our history.Where have you been m8?>>224036947You aren't able to comprehend at its very core what makes something evil. So this conversation can reach no resolution.You'll have to cope.>>224036978(you)>>224037931>creation from evil something actually abhorrent to naturethe show states this though, because in all of Frieren's life and further than that her mentor's life (Serrie) demon's have not once shown anything close to love. For something with intelligence that implies evil.>>224038948I have a friend with Aspergers who more or less fits your criteria to the letter.He feels nothing, he learned through brute force mimicry, but he still feels nothing.He is also super shady and I would never trust him with anything of any great importance.Now imagine he isn't just this grey slab of no empathy, but outright commits atrocities daily.Of course we would view him as evil.I'm not going to genocide the guy, but you fucking better believe for anything that matters he is always arms length at best.Ain't even throwing shade, it's not like he has the ability to fucking care. We play video games and talk every once in a while.A perfect example of him practicing mimicry is the fact he has slown down to only dating one girl at a time, not because he cares about them, but because the perception of him being a manwhore was actually hurting his sexual conquest.Dating one woman leaves him as desirable and not a creep, he breaks up with that girl and moves onto next one repeating the cycle.I don't know why people imply that all people are somehow morally gray, some people are objectively just not a part of our world and we must for the betterment of everyone treat them different with escalations to how different we treat them.
Why are Frieren fans always such fucking chads?
>>224041908>Why are Frieren fans always such fucking chads?It's the natural reaction to want to protect beautiful and innocent things.
>>224033306Anime often goes a bit overboard with the "Look at me, I'm cartoon villaining!"
Because corrupt people in power want to be talk-no jutusu'd instead of hanging from the street lights.
>>224033306I feel like people who say this didn't really understand the demons in Frieren. They are incapable of love and empathy but the point is that the humans in Frieren's world still sympathize with them, even pity them for not being able to feel that, because empathy is integral to human nature. Frieren deals with them in a utilitarian way and understands that there is no changing them or fighting their nature any more than a human could make a flesh-eating virus their pet. But humans don't have the benefit of her millennia of experience so they aren't wrong for thinking a demon is capable of good or that they can be reached.
>>224042188My takeaway was not to be fooled by words. Your enemies will try to manipulate you with words but it's just a tool for them to get what they want.
>>224033306>western audiencesit's not
>>224033498That's the point of the show, demons are not "someones" they are entities taking human form to prey on them. Just like Alien in my time, there were people trying to humanize them while the whole fucking point of the concept was that there was nothing available in them for you to empathize toward aliens. But in Frieren while it's repeated again and again that they're basically skinwalkers, there's still people like you
I love this little cock goblin so much
>>224033469
>>224033306It doesn't mindbreak western audiences, it triggers communists because it describes their methods perfectly.
>>224033306It only pisses off specific people. The reaction to this shit made so many retards tell on themselves.
