What challanges do you as a man think are exclusive to the male gender?>can a woman participate in the thread?Yes but be respectful to others.
>>85865201>challenges you face as manThe opposite gender won't have sex with me
>>85865201instantly being perceived as a threat and off putting, not being allowed to be shy
>>85865201In all relationships you have no inherent valueWomen can always get someone who wants them but if ur a man you have to have something to provide all the time and standards are higher for you
i imagine constantly being ignored or rejected, not just for things you dream of happening but even for minor things that should happen for everyone
>>85865220>not being allowed to be shy>>85865228>but if ur a man you have to have something to provide all the time and standards are higher for youDo you think these issues are becoming less severe with the deconstruction of gender norms?
Hi OP here, i am going to write down all of the struggles and challanges you mentioned or will mention to research later on my own, so please feel free to express the issues that are unique to the male gender regardless of how minute or severe they are.
>>85865295No, because gender norms are not created out of thin air, they derive from biological inclinations, and if anything getting rid of the cultural constructs around them and leaving all to nature makes things worse
>>85865201The whole women are wonderful effect cognitive bias, which assures that women are always given the benefit of the doubt no matter how shitty their behavior is. Look at normalfags and plebbit for this, the latest televised fake rape case is a good example. Absolute rush to judgement and jumping of the gun even when evidence proving she lied was right there from the beginning. In practice this means "equal" laws will never be applied equally.
>>85865201Heterosexuality not being real for men. Opposite sex not desiring or finding your sex attractive. I even see chads being sidelined because they're not women.
>>85865201To have no one on the planet want to spend time with you. Only a man can be that worthless
>>85865669>Look at normalfags and plebbit for thisIt's even present on this board and 4chan as a whole>Women can never be held responsible for anything>Women can never be held accountable for anything>It's always somehow a man's faultLiterally both feminists and conservatives share this same exact belief framework.>>85865201>Male genital mutilation>Males being aborted>Daughters being preferred over sonsThese are modern western phenomena but still applicable
>>85865646>because gender norms are not created out of thin air, they derive from biological inclinationsThey are derived from biology for sure, but culture plays a massive role that can't be ignored.
>>85865669>The whole women are wonderful effect cognitive biasI see, yeah women can get away with lots of stuff that men can't, they recieve lower prison sentences than men, but this effect is probably caused by culture instead of being inherent to human nature, conservatism and feminism go hand in hand in portraying women as weak and pure, chivalry is a big part of western cultures. In other countries women get executed for murder like men, the west still has a long way before it reaches true equality, they can learn from the chinese.
>>85865804>These are modern western phenomena but still applicableNo these are not western phenomenas, they exist in my country in the middle east too, conservatism seems to have a preference for women and it values women more than men, that's global.
>>85865899>conservatism seems to have a preference for women and it values women more than men, that's global.Actually, you are right. Conservative/tradition gender roles hugely benefits women over men in a disproportionate way. Women are basically encouraged to fulfill their biological purpose de facto. Men are expected to prove themselves before being allowed to fulfill their biological purpose. Women are provided for, taken care of, and shielded. Men are the ones expected to die for their nation and also the ones expected to toil doing the hard jobs while women stay in the comfort of their homes. I view conservatism as a type of pseudo-feminism. That's why I cannot identify myself as a conservative.
>>85865936Well now you are learning anon, nothing harmed men more than conservatism, feminism is supported by men and enabled by us because many men want to be "chivalrous" to women, even if they don't use that word, they want to prove themselves as being "protectors" of women to feel good about themselves, conservatism and feminism go hand in hand in screwing us over. Conservatists sell men religion and "purpose" and tell them "you are the big man" "you are better than women" "women are weak" these narratives are harmful to men.Chivalry, conservatism, religion, feminism, they all decided to ruin the lives of modern men, lots of pain will have to be endured before men decide to opt out not from society but from the lies told to us since centuries.
>>85865201One of the challenges men face is loneliness and a lack of sexual intimacy. This is not wholly exclusive to men, but it's overwhelming men who experience it. This is reflected in the data, with an unprecedented number of young men being single and not sexually active. I don't think people comprehend how consequential this will be. For many thousands of years mate selection was socially arranged. But with the sexual revolution and modern liberal sexual morality men are returned to a state which is startlingly analogous to males of a variety of species in the animal kingdom that are deprived and "weeded out". Many even select themselves out, viewing it as a rational choice.Traditional forms of sexual morality had many problems and they were very harsh on women. The uncomfortable truth is that there is no arrangement in which everyone will be satisfied or in which there is no pain. Thinking that if we only deconstruct certain value structures that we would solve the ingrained principles of violence and exclusion is naive. There's not a magic bullet solution and nobody online selling you one knows anything. It doesn't matter if they are women or PUA/manosphere types. Nature is cruel and it doesn't care.
>>85866148For every lonely man there is a lonely woman, the gender ratios world wide are skewed towards women.
>>85866225This is not true. Gender ratios are actually skewed towards men in younger demographics, with women comprising a greater share of the population among older demographics. This is exacerbated by immigration. The distribution of sexual partners is also not even, as women are largely hypergamous. This means that a minority of men have many sexual partners while a much larger share of men experience few sexual partners. Women experience loneliness and romantic frustration too, but it is different and not comparable to the total lack of intimacy experienced by many men.
>>85865295No it's getting worse. It used to be that if you were shy and lacking in social capital, people would take pity on you or at least just leave you alone. Now there is total hatred towards quiet people. Normies feel it is their duty to chase them out of town like the Frankstein monster. You get rewarded with likes and validation on social media for harassing people that are just sitting alone and minding their business. It's seen as a heroic act preventing the next school shooter or serial killer. This is all because of the female obsession with true crime and emotional violence.
>>85865295There is no 'deconstruction of gender norms' in this day and age. The only thing that happened is the infantilisation of modern women where they believe their own gender roles are all icky and oppressive and should be done away with, while fully expecting men to double down on their gender roles instead of shirking them (as would be truly equel) because someone has to take care of the woman-babies.
>>85865201Never being allowed to have wants or needs, always being told to change for a woman's approval
>>85866337>while fully expecting men to double down on their gender rolesIsn't it men who are more conservative on most polls? Isn't it men who pride themselves on being "true men"? Isn't it men who mostly bully gay men or feminine men for not appealing to societal norms? men have their fair share in bigotry.
>>85865295The deconstruction of past gender norms does not, by limiting expectations placed on men, truly improve their ability to actualize their desires. But many shy or avoidant men lack clarity and think that if only society went even further to indulge them that they would have a better state of mind.
>>85865201Prostate cancerTesticular cancer
>>85866505>Isn't it men who pride themselves on being "true men"?and now men have started to reject gender roles women are throwing a fucking hissyfit and trying as hard as they can to put us back on the plantation.
>>85865201Men deal with loneliness and isolation in a way that few women comprehend. Men have 0 inherit value. We are considered worthless for existing. I spent a lot of time in therapy, in and out for 10 years, and even in that medical setting where the goal is to help me, a man, it was still always about women.>I have an anxiety disorder and struggle to go outside.Just get a labor job working 60 hours a week to get money for dates with women.>I have depression and don't want to live.But think of the women you'd be unable to provide for if you died.>I was sexually abused by a woman and the trauma from that makes everyday difficult.You have to forgive her and move on. Be a better man.Would a woman be told these things? Would a woman be told to just work 60 hours a week to give money to men and to forgive her abuser? No. She wouldn't. That would be ridiculous. That is what it's like for men. I stopped going to therapy for good this year. It never helped. But I kept trying because, once again, the women in my family all pressured me constantly to go.
>>85866664The modern world is completely against men, but i think there are ways to help men and guarntee them a fulfilling life, none of these ways are conventional though, men should strive to prioritize themselves, abanden social norms that don't fit them, and seek fulfillment in other stuff. I see so many men opting out of society and dating and that's not good, you should instead opt in communities that respect you, search for your tribe, your people, date women you like, and build a community with others that will last, this is hard, but it can be achieved.
>>85866968That is what I have been doing and unlike the "do it for her" approach to therapy it is actually working. Still don't have a girlfriend but I am a lot less lonely and isolated after rejecting advice given to me from society.
>>85867181Society can be good, what many other men fail to understand is that they shouldn't sacrifice their lives for others/society since those are ultimately people who they don't know or view them as expandable, many men get caught in conservatism, nationalism, traditionalism, while forgetting that they are only serving the elites or women here, men need to be like women, they should understand that society benefit them but not really be loyal to anyone, modern men are becoming like that, they don't know why, 50% of men said that they won't fight any war the in the UK, we need to get that number up to 100%, serve yourself, and serve society when it is conveniant, you owe nobody anything.
>>85867240That attitude of "you don't owe anybody anything" is one of the main reasons men are so lonely. No one wants to help the homeless man. They just ship him to a city that voted for the other party. No one wants to rehabilitate the addicted man. They just sentence him to a lifetime of recidivism. No one wants to support the veteran. They just let him kill himself. When I say I reject advice that society gives me I include what you're saying here because that is the common fuck everybody else mentality. We need less of that not more.
>>85867342That wasn't my point, you owe nobody anything, however society as i said is good, you should participate in the things that benefit you, and never ever exert any efforts on things that don't matter to you. It is not an isolating mentality to have
Sheer boyish clumsiness being interpeted as threatening because you have testosterone. There is a brief period in adolescence when male hormones make you go fucking Super Saiyan with the power multipler but your nervous system has not yet caught up. You get accused of being surly and slamming or breaking shit purposefully. You're not. Somebody fucked with the settings. This is even worse if you were an uncoordinated sperg to begin with or the women around you are already terrified of men.
Men have a lot more opportunities in life, though these are opportunities that can go well or poorlyWomen consistently take safer means of employment, but you diversify your portfolio to maintain wealth not make it.What ends up happening is that women and men are on average very similar but you see a lot more guys succeed and also fail at the same time. Women kind of ignore men when it comes to issues like homelessness and only look at all the really rich guys.
>>85866225>the gender ratios world wide are skewed towards womenIt's Halloween. I went to the gym. Most of the people at the gym were men. There were a handful of women. Women are not lonely. They can go to the gym and have their pick in a gender ratio of 9:1 (9 men for every woman). They can go on dating apps and have their pick in another environment where the gender ratio is equally skewed towards women.Where can a man go where the environment has an opposite gender ratio of 9 women for every 1 man? An environment filled with desperate, frustrated, lonely, single women? Women have used politics and manipulation to surround themselves with desperate options, artificially inflate their value from male abundance, and dangling the promise of sex around as a carrot on a stick. Men need to get into politics to enact policy that promotes male self-interest.
>>85867805>Where can a man go where the environment has an opposite gender ratio of 9 women for every 1 man? An environment filled with desperate, frustrated, lonely, single women?This is hitting the nail on head. If there are just as many lonely young single women out there, where are they? They aren't on dating apps, look at the data on that. They aren't at organizations or clubs. This is anecdotal but any group activity I've gone to has been mostly men and the women that are there are nearly all already in a relationship. And this is for hiking and running or reading, not overtly male dominated hobbies like tabletop games or video games. After university men do not have any reliable opportunities to meet women. Women have built many different kinds of social faux pas around dating and expressing romantic interest. They don't want to be cold approached or approach others, don't like apps because there are too many options and men are too pushy, and scrutinize meeting people through work. There are many ways they rationalize this (e.g concern for their safety), and however legitimate or illegitimate they may be, the effect is the same. They have access to both casual sex and romantic intimacy in a way an average man just does not have, and it is at their discretion and convenience. Women are the gatekeepers and they get to choose what happens and when.
