is it really that bad to want to be loved and cherised by other people?
>>85857775Yes it's very very bad, horrible stuff. Why? Because it's very hard to get in this rotten world, so you are essentially setting yourself up for a massive disappointment. Not that you have any choice, you can't really stop wanting those things, can you? Even schizoids probably want that stuff deep down. The pain of being a human, I guess. It's a good thing you are at least worthy of being loved and cherished, and someone will probably eventually feel those things for you. I'm not so sure about myself. I think everyone deserves these things, but does the world agree? Doesn't seem like it.
>>85857775No. Being loved means everything. Especially being loved by the people you love.
>>85857775Nothing gave me more meaning to my pathetic existence than the love from a cute depressed girlfailure. I wish god could actually satisfy this hunger
>>85857775It's not bad per se. But it shouldn't be your goal. You subconsciously betray your loneliness. Just like how "I want to make money" won't save you in a career like law or engineering. It can and should be a co-motivation, but not your primary drive. Because that way lay difficult people, such as celebrities and idols or just garden variety narcissists. I don't know what happened to you to ask, anon, but I hope you're at least doing okay.
>>85858044being worthy of it or not doesnt really matter. if the world actually functioned based off karma, then it wouldnt be the hellhole it is today. the point is, the world doesnt even want you to be loved. it doesnt want you to think you're worthy.>>85858208but feelings like that are usually the reason behind many huge mistakes people make in their lives. love keeps you down just as much as it lifts you up. i guess it depends on the person but i struggle to see it as something freeing.>>85858342if we had greater things to yearn for perhaps we wouldnt even worry about this sort of thing.>>85858386why is wanting to be liked by many people always seen as narcissism? isn't it normal for humans to want to be loved and liked by their peers? is it such a great sin that we should try our hardest to avoid? i think there's worse things one can wish to be.
>>85858469>i guess it depends on the person but i struggle to see it as something freeing.Yeah, if you love someone who is a piece of shit then you are just a prisoner, but if you love someone who truly is worth loving and you become obsessed. then it means everything, because life to me is about the fireworks. not about setting them up, not about what comes or after, it's about chasing highs and reaching the pinnacle of human being. idk if i make sense to you. but if our lives are to be a story then we have to play the hero and we have to get our princess and we have to fight the dragon.
>>85858469>why is wanting to be liked by many people always seen as narcissism? isn't it normal for humans to want to be loved and liked by their peers? is it such a great sin that we should try our hardest to avoid? i think there's worse things one can wish to be.In any case, let me start with saying I'm sorry for implying you're a narcissist. That's not what I was trying to say. I apologize. I've never been all that good at emotional talk.Wanting to be loved isn't inherently a flaw. Everyone has that need to some extent. What I was trying to say is that is becomes problematic if that becomes the only lens through which you view the world.Could you please tell me what you mean when you say you want to be loved and cherished by many? What is it about? Is it about having a safe place to belong? Connections that feel "real"?
Very bad, havent you heard that being a dark triad loner is based and redpilled?In all seriousness, everyone deserves to feel loved (unless theyre a guenily unredeemable terrible person). Isoloation is a special kind of hell. They punish prisoners with it, its better to be around psychos than alone. A meaningful conversation with someone is like food for the soul. In the past having a group of people who were like family was a given and within that group there would be a couple of people who were like your soul mates. Shits bleak man
>>85857775As a man? Yes. As a woman? No, it's expected
>OP vanishedMy reply was that bad, huh. So that's what it feels like to press the wrong dialog choice in a video game.
>>85858509>you become obsessedi have been there. but its not fun. its not "chasing the high" its just chasing ghosts. that other person is never going to be as involved as you are. it hurts a lot. i get what you mean with wanting to live life like a story, but eventually we'll just have to face the reality of things. there's no princess to save and no dragon to fight, there's only you.>>85858536>the only lens through which you view the worldwhat other option do we really have, one that is really worth something? chase status, money, possessions? arent all the same thing anyway? maybe you're going to tell me that the world isn't black and white, and we are not forced to choose between absolutes. but i really feel like i am. i dont get how the average joe lives without ideals, or some imperative they must follow or chase.>safe place to belong? Connections that feel "real"?i guess so. i want people to recognize me. to greet me when we meet eachother. i want somebody to wonder where i am if im not there with them. i'd like for people to think about me from time to time. maybe this is what people mean with community?>>85858605yeah, it is just bleak. atomization of individuals will be the death of what humanity we have left. especially if everyone gets brainwashed into thinking that wanting attention is somehow bad.>>85858638it just takes me a while to reply sorry.
>>85858665>there's no princess to save and no dragon to fight, there's only youI could kill myself or I could play around doing what I care about what my feelings want me to do and die later on anyway. most things in life are worthless endevearours, but i hope atleast I will be loved in the afterlife for all the care and effort I put in this one
>>85858665>what other option do we really have, one that is really worth something? chase status, money, possessions? arent all the same thing anyway? maybe you're going to tell me that the world isn't black and white, and we are not forced to choose between absolutes.Of course the world isn't black and white... I understand that on a rational level. Emotionally? To me, it's black and white. I hate it, every time when people tell me to take a nuanced look at things. My mother would often get angry at me but then tell me she loves me anyway. It left me very confused every time. I remain convinced she was angry, not loving. You can't have both. She said I'd eventually understand. It's been well over 30 years. I'd like to start understanding.>but i really feel like i am. i dont get how the average joe lives without ideals,The average joe is miserable, too, or of comically simple mind. But I've had my ideals beaten out of me by years and years of exposure to the "real world". I have to lie to let other people save face so that I can get ahead. It hurts me. But it benefits me. Ultimately, rationality wins out in these cases for me. I've given up on love, a partner, even if my family urges to continue the bloodline. I'm too warped. I've become a simple career man with nothing but social upwards mobility, anime and 4chan on his mind.>or some imperative they must follow or chase.I chose my path because I believed in justice. Now? It's the path of least resistance. I've been worn out, ground down, a shadow of my former self. I suspect that may be the case with many others. So what does drive you, really? What has been driving you all these years? And, most importantly, what is it that you want that drives you?(cont.)
>>85858665>>85858739>i guess so. i want people to recognize me.Relatable, but probably not quite in the same way.>to greet me when we meet eachother.Yo. I thought I was being considerate by not putting on my hat, evidently not.>i want somebody to wonder where i am if im not there with them. i'd like for people to think about me from time to time. maybe this is what people mean with community?If it helps, I've been thinking about you several times this week and looking forward to your usual weekend thread. No pressure if you're not in any state for it by the time it rolls around though. I think that's what people mean when they say "community". It feels nice to belong somewhere.
>>85858469why do foids always do this reply to every single poster in one post shit, I've had 100+ reply threads and never thought to do it because I'm not an attention whore
>>85858759>foidsYou're just making gender conflict talking points up for shits at this point. Isn't it nice someone's taking the time to reply to your post, no matter how stupid it is?
>>85858790you misunderstood the point of my post>>85858739wow tell me more!>>85858638dont worry she came back>>85858386hmm I agree with you anon>>85858208Have to agree with you aswell!
>>85858759it's inherited from the reply thread meta that started abt 10 years ago
>>85858805no nigga I've been here since 2014, its 90% women that do this and 100% its attention seeking threads, I'm talking 4+ replies in one post not 2 or 3 if there are really good posts worth replying to
>>85858739by all means, continue doing what you're doing. im all for the "nothing matters, so why not" mindset. but sometimes i just get these moments of realization that really do make me wonder, "why not">>85858747>It hurts me. But it benefits meyou see, this kind of life is not for me. ive grown to understand how the world works, how reality is, that we need to lie our way through life, that we need to take shortcuts, hurt others, eventually give up almost everything that makes us, "us". i was never okay with this. i still am not okay with this, i can never be okay with this. my life would be a lot easier if i could just not care about this stuff, if i could be as shallow as most other people are, i know that it would be a cakewalk. yet im unable to take advantage of that.>least resistanceisn't this just, really sad? a pathetic way to live life? is this how people really live? i genuinely dont get how anyone would choose living this way forever, over just taking their own lives. im not saying you should, actually, im saying you're stronger than me for not giving into taking the easy path. you say you're on the path of least resistance, but its really not. its the hardest one you could take.>what does drive younothing under my control; I live for other people and it has always been that way. i dont know if its a good thing or not.>It feels nice to belong somewhere.yeah. it really kills me that its so lacking in the modern day. thanks for thinking about me also. and for saying hi.>>85858759im not a woman, and besides, its simply more efficient. why would i reply singularly? just so i can spam the board every 2 seconds with my replies? or maybe i should just ignore everyone that doesnt post a life changing reply.
>>85858859>im not a womanOk, if thats true, I'll admit I was wrong. But can you at least admit you type and sound like a woman lol
>>85858859>my life would be a lot easier if i could just not care about this stuff, if i could be as shallow as most other people are, i know that it would be a cakewalk. yet im unable to take advantage of that.In a way, I admire this way of life. Looking back, I feel like a lot of media tries to portray that life is like that. The wishful thinking of the creators, forced to acknowledge this reality, trying not to foist it onto others, trying to portray the purity they've lost. Phoenix Wright is widely known as a parody series. But there's also something profoundly beautiful about a man who believes in his client, even under insurmountable pressure of seemingly overwhelmingly clear facts and rigged trials.I want to be like that. I want to be more like you. But I know I'm too weak. I've compromised too much already. Yet are either of us happy in any meaningful sense of the word?>isn't this just, really sad? a pathetic way to live life?Yes, it is.>is this how people really live?I don't know. There are enough examples, at least. But the people who I've tried to stick close to are those who weren't like that... at least for a long time. I can tell you some stories, but I imagine you might not be interested, and I assure you that it won't be a very coherent storyline.>i genuinely dont get how anyone would choose living this way forever, over just taking their own lives. im not saying you should, actually,Please don't take this the wrong way, but that "not saying you should" cheered me up. Not that I was going to even if you said it for real, I'd just add you to the list of people I need to outlive.>im saying you're stronger than me for not giving into taking the easy path. you say you're on the path of least resistance, but its really not. its the hardest one you could take.The grass is always greener on the other side. To you, I'm choosing the hard way. To me, you are. I think it's just that no matter what, we'll have to compromise one way or another.(cont.)
>>85858859>nothing under my control; I live for other people and it has always been that way. i dont know if its a good thing or not.It's a good thing. But it's also something that, in my experience, puts you directly in the way of two big risks: burnout and directionlessness. Burnout should be simple. Eventually, you're out of resources. You can't just focus on other people entirely and neglect yourself. It'll catch up with you, typically sooner than you want to. The directionlessness should be self-explanatory. You're experiencing it right now.>yeah. it really kills me that its so lacking in the modern day.I used to try and find a space to fit in. But I tend to say stupid things before I think. Just like how I did in earlier posts. I start a misunderstanding, usually double down in a knee-jerk reaction, and then pack up and find greener pastures after causing a scene. But I don't have enough drive and energy to make my own place. Emotionally, you've done more for me this and last week than anyone else has. I'd like to thank you for that. But would you feel alright about that or do you think you've done nothing special that deserves mention anyway?>thanks for thinking about me also.I'm not doing it consciously but, you're welcome?>and for saying hi.Anytime.By the way, this 2000 character post limit is irritatingly limiting. Let me write my novel for a post.
>>85858885...sure i guess.>>85858929>admire this way of lifegrass is always greener, like you said... i think my life ideals have been conditioned by media a lot. all those stories in books, cartoons, anime, movies. stories of heroes and brave people sacrificing everything for a cause, or for someone else. ever since ive been a kid i always wanted to be that way. like every other kid, i guess; however, it stuck with me even after my adolescence. i still feel the need to be "good", to believe that there's a world where i can be meaningful, i can be brave. perhaps im childish, is all.>either of us happy in any meaningful senseis anybody? happiness is too much of a subjective thing to be attributed to other people i fear.>can tell you some storiesi like stories.>To you, I'm choosing the hard way. To me, you areim really not though. ive just told you i'd prefer to die, before turning into what im not. doesnt that mean i chose the easier way? i only havent reached the point where I have to make the choice yet.>It's a good thingfunny, nobody else told me it is before. everyone always goes on a tangent on why its better to live for yourself, how not worth it it is to trust into others. and i agree with them, acually. im the hypocritical idiot doing it anyway>do you think you've done nothing speciali kind of feel that way for everything i do. but youre welcome anon. im glad that the things i do are special for someone.
>>85859019>i think my life ideals have been conditioned by media a lot.Welcome to the average Western experience. The concept isn't novel. Fairy tales have been around for ages and they've been influencing children, too. Der Struwwelpeter is a nice example, though one that was meant to steer behavior more than being a cultural export or giving demoralized adults an outlet. I don't want to say you're a victim as much as anybody else, since I don't think anyone in the chain meant harm. It just kind of happens to you when you grow up surrounded by these stories.>ever since ive been a kid i always wanted to be that way.You never had a villain phase?>i still feel the need to be "good", to believe that there's a world where i can be meaningful, i can be brave. perhaps im childish, is allIf you'll allow me, I'll be a bit direct. You live for other people. You want to be meaningful. But who decides what is meaningful to you? Would it be meaningful if you published a book? A PhD thesis? Saving a life? Erasing fortunes by throwing the stock markets into disarray? Delivering shareholder value? Disrupting an area of business?>happinessLasting happiness, to me, doesn't exist. It's only meant to be temporary, to keep our brains searching for more of it.>i like storiesSee separate post, it'll take a bit to write.>doesnt that mean i chose the easier way? i only havent reached the point where I have to make the choice yetAgain, I can't speak for you. But it's another thing when you're actually one physical action away from when you do it. I couldn't do it. I resigned myself to continuing to live. I'm by no means trying to glorify either choice. Personally, I'd rather you didn't and I don't want to encourage you to choose the way out.>nobody else told me it is beforeWhy would I negate someone's way of life when I'm in the same ballpark? I'm enough of a hypocrite already, I don't feel the need to be one towards you right now, so I'd rather not given the choice.(cont.)
>>85859019>>85859168>im the hypocritical idiot doing it anywayDo you agree or do you just outwardly agree? If you genuinely, actually agree: You might have a contradiction in your internal value system. I doubt I can elicit it out of you; in my experience, I only ever managed to identify and possibly extract those in periods of reflection. Maybe a therapist could help the process, who knows, I've never gone like the stubborn mule I am.>i kind of feel that way for everything i do.If you like: feeling nothing you do is special,then I recommend: skipping your graduation ceremony for each of three degrees.>im glad that the things i do are special for someone.I think I've said it in a prior thread in less strong words already, but it's my little sancutary every weekend. Sometimes, it doesn't take much to be of help.
>>85859019>>85859168>i like stories.This is a story of a man whom I've drifted apart from. He's a smart man, like, wicked smart. He's definitely at least a step above me and it's plainly obvious. We met on an IRC channel by mutual interest. We'd soon realize that we shared the same sub-interests. But unlike me, he doesn't need much sleep. Three to four hours a day and he'd be off to the races. I already start rapidly collapsing with just seven hours a day. But he's also very prone to obsessing over things. I take intense interest. But if he took interest? That was most of his life. He'd reduce everything else to minimum to stay functional. He'd write notebooks full of just one word.Eventually, I'd piss off said IRC channel with an off-hand remark. I held different views than I do now and they weren't compatible with the rest of them. Later, I'd learn there was a coordinated smear campaign that'd drive me out. But he always held with me anyway. I'd get all the goodies, still get to get my interests and ideas into discussion indirectly, an eminence in shadow... through a man much smarter than me. I never did understand why he liked me that much. It was less than a year before I couldn't provide much value anymore as I'd lost most context. Sure, we were pretty compatible, but he seemed to hit it off well with most people. He kept me alimented with gifts and goodies anyway.(cont.)
>>85857775Would you cuck me?
>>85859216One day, we'd have a long discussion about how we view the world. I held and continue to argue that it's a zero-sum game. For one person to gain happiness, another must lose. Perhaps they feel differently about it so that doesn't zero out, but ultimately, all value in the universe is zero-sum. I was surprised to learn that he disagreed. Not only that, but he presented me with a hypothetical.He asked me to suppose that he find ten bucks on the ground. Nothing life-changing but a non-trivial amount. How would I feel about it? My answer was that I wouldn't care. It doesn't impact my relationship to him. Similarly, he was somewhat surprised to see that. He'd thought I was more of an empath. But something I can neither see nor influence: what is it my business?I often think back to that episode. I wonder how a world in which a net positive of happiness can exist would work.He also saved my hide on several occasions with sharp insights. I learned much about how to get by and playing office politics from him.Sadly, we eventually ended up drifting apart as he started having a wife and family, causing his priorities to shift, though I'll always look up to him.If you're reading this: Godspeed, motherfucker. Keep doing your thing. I miss you, even if towards the end we talked less than once every three months.
>>85857775>want to be loved and cherised by other peopleI don't think it is a want you can just turn off. I turned it off after a year of intense introspection. And it feels like people who don't have it probably got enough of it as a child-teen. They of course will never understand being a starving person for your whole life.
