Why do right-wing grifters like pensandpoison and that Joon girl complain endlessly about “Marxism” and “wokeness” allegedly killing the artistry of modern literature when right-wing conservatives were pumping out all sorts of slop novels in the 90s and 2000s? Picrel, for instance, was about a state governor covering up his daughter’s death from a botched abortion because he needed support from abortion rights orgs to win his re-election and is later exposed by a Christian news anchor with prophetic powers; this crap is no different from a Sally Rooney novel or “Yesteryear” just neocon/Evangelical in orientation with the same dogshit writing style. Tons of hypocrisy and ignorance on the part of the “anti-work” literary critic crowd.
>rightists are inconsistent, news at 11
The right doesn't try to make balanced potentially self-defeating arguments in general. Even the most altruistic members of the left rarely do this, in fact. Both sides are sometimes capable of bringing up counterpoints when bringing them up lends a certain amount of credibility which may outweigh the damage the facts do to their argument.Say you're a conservative who bought an old plantation mansion and you want to show it off to your relatives. Part of the Thanksgiving invitation isn't going to be that you keep Cousin Paul the retard chained to a ring mounted to the side of the old slave bunkhouse in the woods adjacent to the property.You're talking about YouTube grifters op. They're going to grift.
>>25612277>Frank PerettiCalling his books “slop” is way too generous.
>>25612277No one should care about Sally Rooney.
>>25612277>like pensandpoison and that Joon girlAsk them, since you know who they are. I do not, and logically therefore I cannot answer for what they think or believe, much less what you claim they think or believe.
>>25612289As one would expect from any group of free individuals representing a multiplicity of worldviews.
>>25612277>OH YEAH WELL 30 YEARS AGO...shut the fuck up
>>25612357Correct. There is far more diversity of thought in the right than in the left, which subsequently makes “the right” appear inconsistent.
>>25612277>was about a state governor covering up his daughter’s death from a botched abortion because he needed support from abortion rights orgs to win his re-election and is later exposed by a Christian news anchor with prophetic powers;Sounds like it was specifically written on behalf of an anti-abortion group. Wasn’t Operation Rescue a thing in the 90s?
>>25612383It’s relevant to the discourse of today since it disproves the narrative that “wokeness” is the origin of literary slop.
>>25612277>neocon/EvangelicalTwo entirely different ideologies, imbecile.
Right wingers don't have control of the culture industry and can't effectively elevate someone like Peretti to the point of high social standing. Rooney is a Trinity College graduate and has received numerous highly prestigious awards for merely appealing to the urban liberal-left bourgeois worldview. Understanding the right wing critique as nothing more than "leftists write slop" is bad faith to the extreme. You're missing the entire point about the intersection between institutions and culture construction. Which is surely performative because leftists are totally fine with these critiques when it was postmodernist philosophers making them.It really goes back to that tweet about leftists pretending to not understand anything thereby making discourse impossible.
>>25612408The entire corporate nexus supports the right-wing. If you’re a socialist seeking to publish a novel with an explicitly anti-capitalist message you’ll face an extreme amount of difficulty.
>>25612277I don't know the specific Youtubers but this has been my issue for years. Right-wingers (rightfully) complain about pushy left-wing media but rarely create anything of worth
>>25612409Why would it be difficult to publish an anti capitalist novel but not anti capitalist non fiction? There's plenty of socialist non fiction sloppa out there. Now compare this to far right non fiction which is often outright banned along with far right parties (depending on your country). Even the stuff that's released online frequently pulls punches.Also Rooney is openly Marxist and her books critique capitalist and have communist characters. Like, you've got the fiction you want, it just sucks.
>>25612408Christian publishing was a huge industry in the 1990s and for most of the 2000s. I think you’re underestimating how much power over mainstream culture conservatives had in that era.
>>25612408Interesting how conservatives have been calling out this very exact issue of liberal mediocrity in culture and academia for a while now.
>>25612436Sure, they definitely had more influence 30 years ago. But it's since declined. Their power base deriving from religious institutions is inherently weak because religious attendance in a secular society is totally optional. Not only this, but religious institutions also aren't safeguarding knowledge the way they did in the past. Universities do safeguard knowledge and establish the criteria for legitimate discourse and are staunchly leftist.Sure right wingers can get stuff out there but it's seldom deemed legitimate. Just look at the recent leftist anxiety over the right wing podcast network (also a good example of right wing dissatisfaction with traditional institutional channels). Like I said, it's not that leftists just produce slop, but that they can create a culture where slop is held in high esteem which has all kinds of flow on effects.
>>25612277Has anyone here actually read this particular book, or anything Peretti has written? I had a friend in high school who was obsessed with his novels and the Left Behind books.
>>25612277Nobody knows right wing "art" exists. For one, it's trash and nobody enjoys it. Second, even if a right wing artist did exist, they would have to quit and find a day job because his stingy people won't support him. Look at that sad italian that put himself into 100k of debt to build a Charlie Kirk statue just to find no buyers and for his gofundme to get a sad 3k.
>>25612408>It really goes back to that tweet about leftists pretending to not understand anything thereby making discourse impossible.Said by the guy who cannot understand germ theory and believes the earth is flat. I don't know why rightists love this retarded tweet. Your side literally makes the most basic discussion impossible.
>>25612485Right-wingers have no ability to feel or express empathy (if they did they’d be leftists). You can’t make worthwhile art without a strong sense of empathy.
>>25612485Then they blame us poor Jews. It's tiresome bros. If right-wingers made things that could sell we would be happy to sell it.
>>25612593LARP
>>25612593Bait post made by a right winger but yeah, you people are fucking retarded lunatics who scream "JEWS!" or "SATAN!!!" any time you see something you don't like. Even on the "le smart board" /lit/ where all the right wing "intellectuals" hang out you people are still screaming about JEWS and SATAN in every thread the same way the homeless man on the street does.
>>25612277Right wingers who post online are downwardly mobile members of the lower middle class. They are just smart enough to be frustrated by their lot in life, surrounded by people who care only for the foobaw game, but they lack the talent or connections to escape. Dedpite that, their criticisms of left-leaning culture creators and the ecosystem that nourishes them are mostly correct.
Are Christians right wing?
>>25612466>tfw the first person to warn about wokeness in American schools was a gay Jew who died from AIDSFucking Kek.>inb4 “Straussian cabal”Doesn’t exist.
>>25612635An astute take, Anon.
>>25612408>Right wingers don't have control of the culture industry
>>25612685She hasn’t had a pop hit in like six years.
The problem I have with people like PaP and her ilk is that she seems hellbent on the idea that only conservatives can create literature that reveals a moral message or grand commentary on human existence. Anyone can look at conservatives today and see that's not the case at all. As it is, 99% of the right-wing MO consists of bullying the left (communists, queer people, feminists, anti-racist activists, etc.). Just look at podcasters or right-wing YouTubers to see clear examples of this notion. What "profound moral message" is this supposed to be? A novel written by a conservative where the message is "queer people are crazy, only cishets are mentally balanced, only a society that promotes heteronormativity can ever be stable" is not something that would ever make for meaningful art.
>>25612402No one is saying that you disingenuous fuck.
>>25612405Explain.
>>25612277The online right doesn't actually read or seek out. Like all internet whiners, they want everything spoonfed to them.
>>25613039Case in point: this and Orc City are the kind of slop the modern right produces.
>>25612277>muh left/right culture warnow that both sides are unmistakably retarded and undeniably gay, maybe something decent will come alonghttps://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Pov0MKuyJfg&ra=m
>>25612480I looked for reviews of it on YouTube and this is all I found:https://www.youtube.com/shorts/zWDj8itghSQhttps://youtu.be/4kDJXO_DI74?si=BJPYe7ofgbe2qLOd&t=22
>>25612277So what? Your blaming conservative authors for writing what is true to their experiences? They aren't allowed to profess a belief in ideology or philosophy that disagrees with your sensibilities?Why is YOUR slop any better? Does it really matter if its pig feed or chicken feed, other than which animal they foster?
>>25612384The only thing that unites the right is "we aren't the left."It can't decide whether or not it's neocon, free market libertarian, or populist/Trumpist.
>>25613077>It>neocon, free market libertarian, or populist/TrumpistLil bro thinks the right is one person LOL.
>>25613079The point is, the American right doesn't stand for anything anymore, especially now that the failures of MAGA have become much more apparent. At least the left is slowly getting its shit together coming off of a handful of DSA victories and has some kind of notion of what they want. The right doesn't.
>>25613110It all goes in cycles.
>>25612669>>25613049https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Oh6DmjQahohttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oxz06SwfnlU
>>25612277Frank Peretti is pretty good for christslop
>>25613142For me, it's Ted Dekker
>>25613142Peretti's novels are just beach literature or the kind of lit you see sold at pharmacies but for Evangelicals. I've read like five of his books and all of them were dogshit. Fourth-grade reading level.
>>25612277>pensandpoison and that Joon girl>caring what these literal whos think>ever
>>25612277Its mostly because that version of the right became instantly uncool with the election of Bush.
>>25612669Doesn't really disprove what he said. Judge the content not the person otherwise you're committing an ad hominem fallacy but who the fuck am I kidding, logical argumentation is a tool of oppression according to the left. I retract my statement.
>>25613110Well to be fair, the left never had much of a foundation either, built on the idea that anything can be justified if it serves a purpose, including acts of theft, vandalism and petty crime as well as even straight up infanticide if solves a particular prior injustice. The left doesn't think in terms of custom and habit but rather in terms of ends-justify-the-means. Its always been that way so the right has been reduced to babysitting the left due to the fact that the latter has been dictating culture for the last 70 odd years.
>>25613192That anon is clearly on Bloom's side, dummy. "Straussian cabal doesn't exist" gives it away.
>>25613140>the west is in a state of moral decline because of philosophical nihilism caused by liberalism, rationalism, science, individualism, and laissez-faire capitalism>man has been turned from faith to reason, from community to the individual, from duty to rights, from inequality to equality, from order to freedom, from self-sacrifice to self-interest>man has become unhinged from the natural moral order and religious faith>platonic philosophy = good; modernism = bad>some men are more fit to rule than others>philosophic statesmen should never be hampered by conventional morality or the rule of law>virtue is the purpose of the city, wise statesmen must use benevolent coercion to make their subjects virtuous>regime should be grounded on piety, political myth, and self-sacrificeFind a flaw.
>>25613200Yeah, Machiavelli was the first leftist. *shrug*
>>25612728Her last hit was Big Foot in 2024, idiot. She's still culturally relevant.
>>25612277>was about a state governor covering up his daughter’s death from a botched abortion because he needed support from abortion rights orgs to win his re-election and is later exposed by a Christian news anchor with prophetic powers; this crap is no different from a Sally Rooney novel or “Yesteryear” just neocon/Evangelical in orientation with the same dogshit writing style.That actually sounds like a decent plot for a novel though.
>>25612466I miss the old right-wing intellectualism.
>>25612408Why do the right accuse the leftists of pretending not to understand anything when acting like they don't understand things is the primary, if not only, political mechanism of the right?Like, you guys are still pretending global warming isn't real, and that god is. Pretending not to understand the world is your entire thing.Upon further thought, is there ANY insult the right uses that isn't a self report? They call people nigger despite being the blackest. They keep calling people gay trans pedophiles, then get discovered as gay trans pedophiles. Is there -any- conservative insult that isn't a self-report?
>>25613210Piety only works when there's a single religion. There's a reason all religious nations got immediately bodied the moment globalism got going, and all the strongest ones now are founded in the differentiation of church and state.Humorously, when church and state get merged again, strong nations start collapsing.tldr, religion is for retarded people
>>25613291>Piety only works when there's a single religion.This is the primary reason the right gives for being anti-immigration.
>>25612277>>25612308To be fair, even Peretti fans will admit Prophet is one of his worst and most boring books. The Oath and The Visitation are miles better.
>>25613293This has been objectively proven to not help. Any right to rule religious nations have goes out the window the moment it must co-exist with a second religion, even if none of that religion is in a particular state.ALL religious nations have collapsed or become entirely reliant on secular ones to survive.
>>25613298>>25613293And that's not even getting into how religions just refuse technological innovation in any of their nono areas, which are randomly generated and can change at any time.
>>25613202Sorry its late, I have things on my mind
>>25613291>strong nationsThat are currently going extinct because they're not having kids. In the long run religion always wins because religious people breed and non-religious people do not.
>>25613330Most of those kids end up deconstructing their religious beliefs and become atheists.
>>25613210All of this sounds like fascism.>>virtue is the purpose of the city, wise statesmen must use benevolent coercion to make their subjects virtuousWe tried that in America with the Religious Right and it failed.
>>25613330Buddy, everyone's been hit by the same demographic shift. Even the religious are having fewer kids.And fewer kids aren't the end of the world. Like, you people have been zerg rushing for all time, and keep getting bodied.
>>25612277Yes, I would like to see Liza critique a Frank Peretti book to see if she thinks Peretti is as awful as Rooney.
>>25613332It sucks that we don't have the same kind of enforcement Saudi Arabia does towards the irreligious.
>>25613291Retarded people tend to have more kids on average. Maybe the problem is being intelligent?
>>25613365One of the most pirated book in Saudi Arabia is the god delusion by Richard Dawkins
>>25612466>The Closing of the American Mind>1987Is this book still worth reading or is it long outdated?
>>25612485>Look at that sad italian that put himself into 100k of debt to build a Charlie Kirk statue just to find no buyers and for his gofundme to get a sad 3k.Fucking KEK!
>>25613298How come Islam is still growing so fast then?
>>25612409>The entire corporate nexus supports the right-wing. No it doesn't >If you’re a socialist seeking to publish a novel with an explicitly anti-capitalist message you’ll face an extreme amount of difficulty.No you won't. Stop pretending to be oppressed.
>>25613377There's a lot of shitholes. Religion loves shitholes.
>>25613287>Like, you guys are still pretending global warming isn't real, and that god is.t. guy whose mental image of "the right wing" comes from how r/atheism was describing Fox News viewers in 2008
>>25613387Note how this man is pretending he doesn't understand the point, and is also pretending that common right wing talking points are not in fact real.
>>25613389>that common right wing talking points are not in fact real."Right wing" is not a unified movement and the average "right-winger" doesn't have much in common with another. Christians, pagans, eugenicists, civnats, Nazis, Zionists, libertarians, nihilists, tradlarpers, anprims, AI accelerationists, monarchists, incels, TERFs — all that is the "right wing".
>>25613396Note how the right winger is again pretending not to understand the point, and attempting to slide out of rightful blame for the behavior of his in-group.
>>25613397What point am I pretending not to understand? Spell it out.
>>25613399That the right wing has put incredible political pressure into pretending things that are objectively real are not.Your party's officials are STILL regularly denying global warming, and you know this, And you are pretending not to.And that's ignoring all the religion based policies you push.
>>25613368Not only is it worth reading, it's damn well prophetic.
>>25613406What does it argue and has it been refuted?
>>25613387What does it mean to be "right wing" then, genius?
>>25613210>Find a flaw.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NNEkcfxxHU
>>25613445Not adhering to one or more left-wing beliefs. For example if you're against immigration you're right-wing
>>25613491Wow, what a patently useless definition.It was a real easy question too, it's someone who votes for right wing policies and candidates.Are you a bot, or just like 30 IQ?
>>25613210>>the west is in a state of moral decline because of philosophical nihilism caused by liberalism, rationalism, science, individualism, and laissez-faire capitalismThis is literally just Frankfurt School bullshit.
>>25613494>it's someone who votes for right wing policies and candidatesNot really
>>25613494Many or most right-wingers despise those parties. Trump and Meloni are hated on /pol/
>>25612277> noooooooooo abortion is le good ;_;
>>25613609Modern 4Chan alone proves that abortion is morally correct
>>25613511>>25613603Yes yes, and leftists hate each other too, that doesn't make them not leftists.I swear, why is every right winger such a special snowflake? Your shit isn't new or special.
We got a few Daily Show with Jon Stewart enthusiasts ITT to share their bountiful political knowledge with us.I hope they arent a grown adult with those opinions or it would be even more embarrassing
>>25614115>seething about the daily showlol
>>25613609The novel is garbage regardless.
>>25612466Surprised modern conservative politicians don’t cite this book more when talking about the evils of wokeness.
>>25614197Because it was written by a gay Jew who died from AIDS.
>>25613496Which “Frankfurt School” member are you talking about, specifically?
Name me a single good novel with an explicitly conservative message or theme.
>>25613039>implying the left doesn’t severely bully people with cancel culture
>>25614254NTA but Marcuse
>>25613609It is good. Less morons.
>>25614197Most conservative politicians are utter birdbrains who can’t read to begin with.
>>25612408>liberals turn out slop because they control the culture industry>conservatives turn out slop because they don’t control the culture industryOkay.
>>25614562Conservative slop authors don’t get the same accolades as liberal slop authors.
>>25614469It's hilarious to me that the greatest fear of the right is being held accountable to their actions.It reminds me of how farmers nowadays are having a freakout that people might start voting to cut their benefits. The economy's poor, so people want their shit cut, they've been openly hostile to over 50% of america, so those people hold no goodwill towards them, they've been complaining they are in crisis for 100 years, so nobody will believe they need more money.
>>25614684Peretti is quite literally a huge celebrity in the Evangelical and conservative world.
I'm mostly apathetic "leftist" who is checked out of that stuff, find much of it suffocating and moralistic, and also prone to magical fantasy unicorn thinking, but the right is often funny to me. There's also different kinds of right, as anons have pointed out. Sometimes the right is entertaining in a barbaric grug-brained way. I mean, objectively, if you really do a sociological analysis of the mass base of people who vote for right-wing political parties, you can hardly deny that they are idiotic cattle with varying levels of personality disorders. Not even bulls, but steers (with their balls chopped off). They'll follow the one with the biggest horns even if he leads them into a slaughterhouse. Where right-wing culture really is popular, it's like going into a Croatian paramilitary death squad:https://youtu.be/89FB43fRabwBut that stuff can also be based (retarded). Like something so stupid it's fun. But then I'll see threads like this and people argue about why right-wing literati are not receiving accolades from... I don't who exactly. I'm not sure who hands out literary awards. At any rate what I'm describing is like how Nick Fuentes despises his own audience (as a bit) and scoffs at the idea of moving to a red state, he prefers to live in the general vicinity of libs. They all know that the average rightoid is a dullard. But to his credit he isn't out looking for accolades from, well, someone inform me abaout who is giving those out. Does it really matter? Do you really seek it? Like if it's all a racket anyways, then maybe that can free you up to do something yourself without relying on the Academy Awards or whatever. It's worth thinking about.
>>25614762I'm Christian (Catholic) and I've never heard of him until this thread.
>>25614248Most conservatives are secretly gay.
Meanwhile, here's some conservative "music" from the same era:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_YfZIQFxmxw
>>25613367Holy cope lmao. I’ll believe Arabs are flirting with atheism when pigs fly
>>25614562Conservatives have to settle for whatever they can get. Beggars can't be choosers.Meanwhile, liberals CAN be choosers and they deliberately choose to uphold slop.
>>25615024>Does it really matter? Do you really seek it?I mean, yeah. Say what you will, but when a writer gets a Booker Prize or a Pulitzer people will read them. I certainly do. It is a ticket to influence.That said I do agree leftist/liberal (they really are so very interchangeable) control over publishing hasn’t mattered as much with self publishing and things like Substack. At least you can get eyeballs.
>>25614115Sorry bro, I'm a communist and I reject both the right and liberals (who are simply right-wingers in denial).
>>25613067She's cute.
>>25615148The Arab World is more atheist today than it's ever been in history.
>>25613210>>some men are more fit to rule than others>>philosophic statesmen should never be hampered by conventional morality or the rule of lawOnly things out of this list that leftists would disagree with. Where is this from?
>>25614254All of them.
>>25615084He was just interviewed the other day.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhsxr_uU7MQ
>>25613039>>25612277>>25613110I have not bothered to read most of this thread, but as a nationalist of a European nation I can safely say American "convervatism" is a fucking plague than only consists of selfish individualism and puritanism. No wonder they cannot make good art if your ideal of a Vaterland is a wallmart parking lot, and unironically think that empathy four your fellow countrymen is a bad thing.
>>25612277Oh wait I just remebered it is the american midterms, I guess a few more weeks until the internet becomes useable again
>>25615398The neocons were the best faction of the America right: non-degenerate, pro-traditionalism, pro-American.Trump and MAGA are retards and free market fundamentalists are fools.
>>25613609There is not a single logical argument against abortion.
>>25615402Neocons are (they are in power again with Trumps second term) just liberal warmongers, their goal is till to terraform the entire world into American melting pot liberalism. That's why they invaded Iraq, Afganistan, and why they just attacked Iran. The only Americans I do no consider an enemy of my country are the hardcore isolationists.
>>25615423>(they are in power again with Trumps second term)Absolutely not. Trump is as anti-neocon as they come. Neocons were smart and had a clear vision. Trump and MAGA are idiot retards.
>>25615431>Neocons were smart and had a clear vision.That's why the invasions of Iraq an Afghanistan were such resounding successes of course.
>>25615433They miscalculated.
>>25613210Based
>>25615422Way too many people are under the assumption that everyone giving birth is a genetic superman and not a bunch of 1/10's giving birth to crack babies.
>>25615440They fucked up, just attacked weaker countries than Iran, with an actual on the ground military invasion. In many ways their failure is even more embarassing as they could not keep control of a relatively weak enemy country.They also had a similar goal to the current attack on Iran: American imperialism.
>>25615455Neocons were still much better than MAGA in spite of the wars.
>>25612277The right seethes over everything.
>>25613210Any intellectual worth their time was making critiques like this in the mid 20th century, whether left or right.
>>25612277I have never read Peretti. Is he worth my time?
>>25615282Okay, sure. There’s one or two cryptoatheists in Dubai, cool. Meanwhile the masses are hardcore Islamist, arguably more so now than ever before. Arab governments have far more to fear from ISIS types stirring up trouble than they do from atheists wanting secularism
>>25616149Not unless you like preachy Christian fiction. He’s was below CS Lewis in terms of writing style and way, way below Lewis in terms of theology.
>>25612277The right rarely ever puts forth intellectual arguments anymore. All they do is appeal to outrage.
>>25612277Randy Alcorn is like Peretti but worse. I’d suggest reading him if you want to torture yourself with poorly-written conservative literature.
>>25616155Bullshit. Most “Muslims” in Egypt, Iraq, Türkiye, Tunisia, etc. are actually atheist.
>>25616474Citation needed
>>25612669>>inb4 “Straussian cabal”>Doesn’t exist.Yeah, never mind the fact that the Claremont Institute basically controls Trump and Vance.
>>25616657Claremont is a meme.
>>25616149He's a action/thriller/horror pulp author but christian
>>25616868Are his books really trash like OP claims?
>>25615423Trump got involved in foreign adventures for the same reason Obama did. He was frustrated by how little power the POTUS actually has to affect domestic policy, and he wanted some dramatic shortcut to cement his legacy, so he succumbed to the temptation to recklessly use the outsized level of power the POTUS has to affect foreign policy. Neocons are absolutely celebrating this turn of events and will probably benefit from it politically in coming years, but they weren't the main reason it happened. You can tell they weren't that involved because if they had been they would have made an effort to sell the war to the American public months in advance and they would have included some weird creepy rhetoric about bringing wholesome liberal values to the Iranian people.
>>25616889No but they're nothing special either. Decent way to spend an afternoon if you're into that kind of thing
>>25616897> will probably benefit from it politically in coming yearsHow? Barring a land invasion the US will struggle to win
>>25617114I mean the neocons will benefit from MAGA taking a beating in the next two elections. A diminished MAGA will create room for neocons to claw back some influence and relevance.
>>25616889Beach literature.
>>25612277>Why do right-wing grifters complain endlessly about “wokeness”follow the money
>>25616657>a literal who group of intellectuals controls a man who's known to be uncontrollable
>>25617217That’s a small side conflict, the way things are going the DSA-Islamist alliance is going to win it all. Neocons and MAGA alike are in trouble
>>25617217On what basis would the neocons return? Most of them are Democrats now and/or old and retired.
>>25617404Neocons never left.
>>25616149No
>>25612277Well, has anybody actually suggested that this Peretti guy is high art? I don't think most complainers want this guy elevated OR Sally Rooney fed into a woodchipper, they just think it's disingenuous that her sloppa isn't seen for what it is: garbage of equivalent value to this anti-abortion wish fulfilment horseshit. What they want is for people to stop hyping Rooney above the level of "embarrassing airport novel you never heard of", to stop pretending that she's ever written anything of merit, not to start pretending that Peretti did.
>>25612277Let me get this straight. 20 to 30 years ago, right wing conservatives were pumping out all sorts of slop genre fiction hardly anyone today has heard of or read.This means that 2 decades later, nobody is allowed to criticize the ideological capture of the current publishing environment having a negative impact on literature? And these right wing "grifters" you name are hypocrites because instead of talking about things that were a thing 30 years ago before they were born, they are talking about things that are an issue right now?Am I getting this right? If so, I must say that your argument is shockingly stupid.
>>25617440Trump isn't a neocon.
>>25612408Rooney is pro-Palestine tho and has been banned for her political views. She's basically a political prisoner.
>>25617535The point OP is trying to make is that the right believes its own shit doesn't stink and attributes to the left what the right has been doing for decades.
>>25617520Peretti has a huge following among American conservatives to this day.
>>25612277No one takes Marxism seriously when all you guys do is defend Stalin and Bera's pedophilia while also being apologists for Maoist, Pol Potist mass murderFucking kids and murdering is wrong, nobody wants to waste time with you
>>25617628You're conflating online autistic tankies with anime profile pics to highly educated academic Marxists.
>>25617628>Defending pedophiliaThat's just endemic to either direction it seems.
>>25617217MAGA is already neutered and put in the cage by neocons. Why else did they go from isolationists to full on warhawks? Why else was Trump rehabilitated after they noticed that the current left wasn't supporting Americas support of Israel? Why else were swamp creatures like Lindsay Graham and Larry Ellison suddenly Trump supporters?>>25616897>You can tell they weren't that involved because if they had been they would have made an effort to sell the war to the American public months in advance and they would have included some weird creepy rhetoric about bringing wholesome liberal values to the Iranian peopleIs your memory deficient? Before the invasion of Iran there were protests where the Iran governement suppossedly killed 40000 protestors (I have no doubt they shot protesters, but 40000 seems like an exageration). This was the EXPLICIT pretext for attempting regime change. Remember the propaganda images of sexy Persian brunettes burning images of the ayatolla using a cigarette?>>25617217MAGA is the fall guy.
>>25617563>She's basically a political prisoner.Yeah a political prisoner who writes dogshit romance novels.
>>25617404For the same reason democrats ended up with Clinton, Harris and Biden instead of an actual principled guy like Bernie Sanders: both parties are vessels for moneyed interests and parts of the state apparatus. They play up their radical elements to keep people divided and stop said radicals from splintering off, then either during or after the election they kick these people to the curb in favor of centrist liberalism.
>>25612408>Right wingers don't have control of the culture industryThey don't "control" culture because they frown and refuse to participate in it, then they get mad when all of the undesirables support and occupy it. While they play videogames where they yell slurs, women were writing literature via ao3/wattpad.Meb would rather trade crypto, nfts, or ai than work soi jobs like writing.>>25614684Right wingers earn more partipcipation trophies because they relentlessly whine about their nonexistent persecution. Politicians and billionaires alike pressure institutions into handing them fake awards like the Fifa Peace Prize like candy. Their "awards" mean nothing, and that's why right wingers don't value it themselves.
>>25617670That’s completely different from neocons.
>>25617740This anon is undoubtedly a leftist but they are correct. Look at successful right wing civilizations like Islam. A vast ecosystem of right wing writers, speakers, influencers, etc. all are funded by powerful people (Qatar, Saudi, Turkey, etc.) The Western right ceded culture to the left and now wonders why it lost everything.
>>25617627Okay but I’ve never heard of him.
>>25617266Who exactly is paying these people?
>>25613052Fake news
>>25615107>if I say it enough times maybe someone will believe me!
>>25616366You're a leftist. You know how I can tell? You don't leave your hivemind.>>25613397There is no "right wing ingroup" just as Margaret Thatcher says there's no such thing as society. You need direct authoritarian measures to create groupthink. Thats why "left libertarianism" is an oxymoron.
>>25612409>If you’re a socialist seeking to publish a novel with an explicitly anti-capitalist message you’ll face an extreme amount of difficulty.Yeah, Thomas Piketty was really, really oppressedyou people are delusional
>>25613404>That the right wing has put incredible political pressure into pretending things that are objectively real are not.this is coming from the side whose politicians won't define what a woman is btwthere are plenty of right wingers fully aware of global warming/climate change - the question is whether they wanna destroy their industry over it (they don't)>muh religionokay reddit
Never understood the compulsion to obsess over things you have no control over. It's like worrying about if the sun is going to rise tomorrow. You don't have any hand in it.
>>25618693Piketty isn’t a Marxist and his work was praised by a lot of free marketeers.
>>25618693Name a novel published in the past 15 years that had an explicitly communist message.
>>25619057Sally Rooney's.
>>25613067>>25615252https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1eNDLHD6bLs
Lots of directionbrains ITT
>>25617648Imagine this argument but for fascism>You're conflating online autistic nazis with anime profile pics to highly educated academic Fascists.The double standards between the two pretty much gives the lie to whatever apologia is coming out of the leftist's mouth at the moment
>>25619689awful tranny memeFace it. The left is the problem. All leftists are bad. Not all jews or whatever you are implying are bad. Therefore, leftism is the issue.
>>25612277>Why do right-wing griftersAs a classical left wing person I disagree with this assertion. Watch some ShoeOnHead mate.
>>25619727>highly educated academic FascistsNo such animal and you know it.
>>25620097Only in the West. Such people run countries like Pakistan, Malaysia, Indonesia and arguably Singapore.
>>25620097You're ignorant. About half the countries in the world experimented with fascism in the 20th century. There were plenty of academics and intellectuals.
>>25612493>being unable to understand germ theory and believes the earth is flat
>>25619689Explain
>>25619941>Watch some ShoeOnHead mate.Kys, retarded simp.
>>25612506>You can only have empathy if you shove dildos in your ass and worship the Gods of materialism (Karl Marx, Engels, Lenin etc.) o algo
Communism is when trans rights + BASIC. HUMAN. EMPATHY.And Fascism is when ICE and MAGA and when the government did something mean that i don't like.
>>25612485>Nobody knows right wing "art" exists.It's called "epic poetry", which only existed in a time before aryans mutted with blacks. Any other artform is degenerate and semitic in origin.
>>25612601>SCREAMING "JEWS" AND "SATAN" in every thread the same way the homeless man on the street does
>>25620237NTA but consider going to another board if this is the level of post you're going to make
>>25620237Lmao did I touch a nerve?
>>25620253>>25620271see >>25620237
>PerettiWho? WHO? literally WHO?
The Right can't create art.
>>25620277Lmao
>>25620301She ain't gonna fuck you.
>>25620301>>25620305Please, please, both of you, go somewhere else
>>25620243The absolute state of American political “education”.
>>25619504She’s hella cute/l. I’d bang her over Shoe any day.
>>25620789>too dumb to get the joke>makes the most boring post in the worldPlease, you too >>25620356
>>25620283Christian fiction author who writes airport lit “thrillers” with a distinctly neocon agenda.
>>25620305? I never said she was? Why do you degrade women like that? You think that's the only reason why people listen to her.>>25620356This is literally a political thread boi.
>>25612277Does anyone know where I can find a PDF of this particular book so I can judge it for myself?
>>25612277Why are conservatoids so obsessed with abortion?
>>25621191Because they're moralfags that can't stand the idea of an innocent child dying. I on the other hand understand that it's okay for innocent children to die under pragmatic circumstances, like certain reasons for abortion.
>>25618699The left's stance is literally that trannies are mad and require medical attention, anon.If an obsessive delusional isn't damaging anyone, you go along with the obsession. It's why religion is tolerated.The trannies and the religious are practically identical in how they react to pointing out their similarities.
>>25621756>The left's stance is literally that trannies are mad and require medical attention, anon.You people's dishonest on here is shocking. I know it shouldn't be by now, but still is.The left's position is that trannies are CORRECT in their delusions and should have surgery to conform to themIt's so fucking insane how you guys argue with chuds on here and pretend to be more right wing than them on every positon>ACTUALLY the left is the REAL party against immigration>ACTUALLY the left is the REAL party against tranniesTake note of this incredibly dishonesty, friends, they will say ANYTHING
I've never met an "American Conservative" who was a good artist. The right-wingers who make good art tend to be much more hardcore politically. Fascists like Dali or Mishima, or like Borges who supported Argentina's military dictatorship.Hell, even every contemporary interesting right-wing writer/thinker I can think of wouldn't really be classed as an "American Conservative" in the "vote for Reagan" sense of the term. It's a bit of an artistically sterile political movement, and always has been.
>>25621191Wedge issue. Identical to why the left is so obsessed with Palestine.
>>25621191Because it's wrong to murder children.
>>25620967Okay, reading through it now. This is page 3. Already reading this looks like a chore.
>>25620159I have never met a /fit/ flat earther.
>>25621191Because they're ultra-sheltered and believe that lower class peasants and addicts don't give birth.>>25621979Even crack babies?
>>25621763Anon, the current best treatment plan for trannies is to play along with their delusions.It's literally the thing we've discovered has the lowest death rate.Why is it republicans care so much about trannies but haven't read any of the literature on why they are treated this way? You'd think you'd be working on a better way to cure them, not arguing they shouldn't be treated at all like you do currently.
>>25622081That is bullshit. Gender dysphoria is a mental illness and needs to be treated like a mental illness, with medication and therapy. We don't indulge the delusions of schizophrenics and people with bipolar disorder, what makes trannies so fucking special?
>>25622085>With medications and therapyYeah, we've found that the best medications and therapy are giving them estrogen and treating them like a girl.It drops their suicide rate sharper than other treatments, as well as their various violence rates.Like, how do you not know this? This is from the same paper you people get "41%", as that's the PRE-TREATMENT suicide rate.We don't HAVE a cure for obsessiveness, or delusion. The best we can do medically is play along with it if possible. If we could do better, religion would no longer exist.
>>25622037Yikes.
>>25622090My objection to trannies is literally on religious grounds. They think they, and not God, get to decide whether they're a man or a woman. They presume to play God and it gets on my nerves. It's an offense and a blasphemy.You CAN, in fact, get treated out of gender dysphoria without taking estrogen and cutting your dick off. To pretend otherwise is to play into the hands of people who think they are the final arbiters of reality.
>>25622102You are arguing from a position that is proven to be statistically incorrect, AND you admit you are actively delusional and believe in sky fairies.You and trannies are the same. If we were in person, I would be nodding along and saying "sure, buddy" because you are likely to become violent to yourself or others when challenged.
>>25622104I don't have to listen to a fedora tipper, materialism is objectively incorrect. It can't prove the hard problem of consciousness.
>>25622108I like how the delusional defense of "Okay, you might be right in REALITY, but is reality even real, man?"When informed that their treatment plan simply works less well than the alternative, they don't try to improve the treatment plan, they just check out entirely because they don't wanna play a game with rules.
>>25622113oh, I forgot the "is something that seems reasonable to them" bit of that. That's what one gets for late night 4chan arguing.
>>25622104Why are you calling him a gigachad?
>>25622117The goal here is to reduce the amount of violence mad people perform, anon.It's why we're even talking about treating these crazies at all. If you wanted to increase violence, it's far easier.
>>25622099No way in hell this prose is better than Sally Rooney.
>>25622166Yeah, this is cheap anti-abortion propaganda.
>>25622170
>>25622166How many literary awards has this slop won?
>>25622081>It's literally the thing we've discovered has the lowest death rate.No, it doesn't you freak. This is a complete lie.
>>25622102If you can't decide things for yourself then what good are you?Fuck, who's to say God himself didn't make them trannies just for shits and giggles?
>>25617670>actual principled guy>like Bernie Sanderslmao this post made my day
>>25612506Suicidal pathological altuism is not empathy
>>25622321They don't have empathy at all. They have woman brained sympathy. It makes them 'feel bad' to see people 'suffer', so they demand an end to whatever is causing that suffering, even if it makes no sense (deportation makes people sad? destroy ICE! No human is illegal!)Empathy involves actually understanding people, which they do not do. Again, they are woman brained, so they either love you like a baby or vilify you like a monster (ie how they portray republicans and such as these cartoon villains who want to do evil for its own sake), both of which are childish approaches to the world that lack actual empathy.
>>25622081>It's literally the thing we've discovered has the lowest death rate.So what? Who cares? That's no justification for perpetuating a lie. If they can't bear the truth, let them die; it's certainly no worse than actively killing an infant.
>>25622090>Yeah, we've found that the best medications and therapy are giving them estrogen and treating them like a girl.>It drops their suicide rate sharper than other treatments, as well as their various violence rates.This is not true, at all. Dhejne et al. states unambiguously that there's no statistically verifiable improvement at all in depression and suicidality from even completed trooning-out treatment.
>>25621191Why are femoids so obsessed with abortion?When you look at polls the most important issues for men are stuff like economy, war, crime and law while the most important issue for women is being able to murder babies.
>>25622597>>25622602This study is literally comparing trannies to the general population, and not comparing them to their previous mortality rates.
>>25622612>>25622345these posts close together are hilarious.
>>25622170Right-wingers actually believe this though.
>>25622170Kek, show this to Liza Libes and see how she ranks it.
>>25616374Isn’t Alcorn a Calvinist?
>>25613077>YOU'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO HAVE DIVERSITY OF THOUGHT JUST DIVERSITY OF SHADES OF BROWN! Lol
>>25623429I never want to see that name posted on this board ever again.
>>25614197Why would they? The book is 40 years old.
>>25613077>>25624053The main uniting factor of the right is denial of objective reality.
>>25624247Bullshit. Rightoids seethe about moral relativism and the lack of objective morality in society today.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbhE21FSZBs
>>25624254It was a right winger that created that one GRRM wojack image bitching about how stories aren't about good and evil anymore.As if fucking Saturday Morning Cartoons are the peak of art.
>>25624254>>25624260Note all of their claims of objective morality are rooted entirely in delusion.
>>25612277Two hypotheses as to why "woke" slop is so heavily pushed by the establishment:1. It de facto discredits radical leftist politics by associating it with superficial bullshit politics, identical to how the Congress for Cultural Freedom pushed a "safe" leftism in the 1950s and 60s in order to counter Soviet Marxism.2. It makes low-tier people from marginalized groups think that they've already won the culture war on the basis that the culture industry is pandering to them using lowest-common-denominator slop.
>>256242544:45 -- LMAO
>>25612277>Why do right-wing griftersOkay fag, give the definition of "Grifter".Then explain what makes people "right-wing" to you.Then finally explain what the fuck it is you presume for us to understand by "Right-wing grifter".I bet you fucking won't, lib-tard
>>25624344Leftists call everything a grift except for actual grifts like BLM and climate change
>>25620235The left right spectrum is a short hand to quickly categorise a whole bunch of disperate ideologies and even at that it is pretty bad. The so called "left" and "right" are artificial coalitions with a shitton of disperate ideologies. The mere fact that ancaps and nazis are both "right wing" even despite the fact that they have nothing in common with each other is fucking retarded (this is also where the le nazis were left wing nonsense comes from). Then on the "left" marxists are lumped into the same category as left-liberal corporate dicksuckers along with labour unions (labour union guys often very sexist, homophobic and transphobic). As you can see in this entire thread, the directionbrains are just attacking strawman positions of the other "side" while complaining they are getting lumped in with the worst people on their "side". Not to mention how America-centric the discussion is.
>>25624335It was mostly to prevent proper organisation on the left post 2008 crash by making them hostile to white people, then has the added benefit of chasing all the white people to the republicans where they can be easily corraled into supporting stupid shit like America and Israels war of agression against Iran.
>>25624344Any conservative with an opinion is now a "grifter."
>>25624254>old dying jew has an opinion
>>25624398WrongThe current ideological conflict is not between the left and the right, it's between the left which is united on majority of issues and the non-leftThe other side has almost nothing in common besides opposing the left and because they have so many opposing views they are not able to unite like the left which is why they have kept losing
>>25624398Also notice that right wingers and conservatives criticise their side all the time but you almost never see leftists calling out the extremists and lunatics on their own side.
>>25624254>"was the holocaust a subjective value judgement?"Yes. Yes it was.
>>25624461I see leftists eat their own all the fucking time. The fuck are you talking about? They're particularly infamous for it.
>>25624344Grifters are to the right what breadtubers are to leftists
>>25624638NAYRT but leftist infighting is about them trying to enforce highly-specific, detailed orthodoxy and conformism on each other, leading to "splitting" as both refuse to be the cog and want to be commanding the machine. What Anon is talking about is leftists morally condemning the excesses and sheer insanity of fellow-travelers, which almost never happens. Say you're a leftist and you start promoting giving puberty blockers to little kids in case they turn out to be trannies later: almost nobody on the left will call this out for the obvious morally bankrupt grotesquery that it actually obviously is to anybody with a functioning brain, instead they'll start quibbling about whether those kids should be considered trannies already or only later once they receive exogenous hormones as well, and start a weird but bitter internecine war over that semantics issue.
>>25624640I love how it’s just assumed leftists who spout their opinions for cash and clout are considered principled while right-wingers who do the same are not.
>>25618757He is a Marxist, his works are dogshit, they weren't praised by a single "free marketer" and the guy is an outright (educated) imbecile on top of that.All this idiot did was that he attempted to "prove" that there are no equality in current economy. No one ever contested that, not a leftist, not a rightist. His "work" is entirely pointless. The point of contention is that inequality is always bad for leftists BUT it is a desirable feature for the economic right, as non-predictive people (like: lazy, inefficient, immoral, unskilled) SHOULD be rewarded less according to them. The guy doesn't have the slightest fucking clue what he's babbling about.
>>25624726This
>>25612308All I remember about him is the book about angels and demons fighting with the woman trying to escape the New Age cult.
>>25612506>Right-wingers have no ability to feel or express empathy (if they did they’d be leftists).he did the meme
>>25612277Artists of both political sides make good and bad stuff. The 90s also had Robert Jordan doing amazingly in fantasy and he’s right leaning (libertarian monarchist.) Today, we got guys like Curtis Yarvin, Jordan Peterson, Bronze Age Pervert and Mike Ma all having written compelling works all representing different types of right wing.
>>25616474even if that's true it doesn't disprove the other anon's point that Islamic countries have more of an issue with hardcore Muslims than atheists/people wanting secularism. I don't remember the last time a "socialist" or "communist" militant group in the Islamic world did anything spooky.
>>25612277I want to know how much these right-wing grifters actually care about literature vs to what extent they're merely pandering to their "anti-woke" audience.
