So the USN needs frigates to counter China's expanding fleet, and our solution is apparently a glorified Coast Guard cutter.Constellation: 32-cell Mk 41 VLS, SPY-6, SM-2, ESSM, real ASWProgram gets bloated, delayed, overpricedNavy kills it after TWO hullsReplacement: Legend-derived FF(X)57mm gun, RAM, modular NSMsNo baseline VLSNo dedicated ASW suite in Flight I"We'll add capabilities later"Peak NAVSEA procurement autism. Did we learn nothing from LCS?Yes, Constellation was a procurement disaster. Taking FREMM and redesigning half the damn ship defeated the point of using an existing design.But here's the problem: THE REQUIREMENT DIDN'T DISAPPEAR.The PLAN is building Type 054A/B frigates with VLS, credible ASW, and escort capability. Meanwhile, we're buying a patrol frigate that can't provide comparable area air defense. A frigate that cannot escort independently against serious air or subsurface threats isn't filling the same fleet gap.And the FY27 request? Roughly $1.4 BILLION for the first FF(X).For what? A missile-armed cutter that needs a Burke nearby when the sky gets spicy?Congress also appropriated roughly $196 BILLION for Ukraine-related assistance and US operations since 2022. Not all direct aid. At hypothetical $1.5-2B frigate prices, that's 98-130 ships in raw budget equivalence. No, you can't conjure shipyard capacity with a check.Yet TWO Constellations are all we can manage.Why not fix the procurement failures and build 30-40 actual frigates? Or buy a simpler, proven design with VLS and ASW from day one?Is FF(X) a clever, affordable distributed-warfare platform, or another underarmed compromise we'll spend 15 years upgrading?If I'm the PLAN, I'm delighted.Tell me what I'm missing, anons. Is faster hull production worth sacrificing combat capability, or has the USN lost the plot?
IMPLESSIVE
>why is my late stage empire doing late stage empire thingsgave another cost plus contract to lockmart award
>>65622247I am convinced you are actually the shill, trying to stifle any discussion about America maintaining its edge over the chinks.That or you are just a fat, insecure retard who never had a Father.
>>65622203>And the FY27 request? Roughly $1.4 BILLION for the first FF(X).>Congress also appropriated roughly $196 BILLION for Ukraine-related assistance and US operations since 2022.The first thing we need to do is to stop giving israel $38,000,000,000 minimum, mandatory, in military aid annually.
>>65622588>maintaining its edge over the chinks>t. can't open Hormuz 9 months laterlol lmao even
>>65622594chinks are losing warships to filipino fishermen
>>65622203>our solution
>>65622247>mm, these laurels sure are comfy
>>65622626>mm, i sure am a concerned westerner
USN procurement is indeed retarded and making mistakes, but this is still a thinly veiled chinkshill thread.
>>65622652Makes me wonder what riled the up the stinky chinkys.
>>65622652excellent image
Didn't read Any way while I think the Legand class in its current for is the wrong choice becuase it does nothing.We do not need drug interdiction boats when satellites exist. Also isnt a Navy job.So after a bit of cost begets cost the BB isnt looking so bad after all.If the Navy even wants surface ships in the missle age. Columbia class SSGN when
>>65622652To be determined new yards are finally getting nuclear submarine workEB and NN buck broken
>>65622593>The first thing we need to do is to stop giving israel $38,000,000,000 minimum, mandatory, in military aid annually. This. All the kikes ever did was rope the US into their retarded regional fuck fuck games. At least the hohols managed to scrap about 40% of Russia's military, including roughly 50% of its surface navy.
>>65622652>USN Procurement can be improved significantly and more attention is needed to ensure it can effectively combat China>CHINKSHILL CHINKSHILL CHINKSHILLSo what, congress and the pentagon are chinkshills too now?
>>65623438mucho concerno
>>65622652shut the fuck up every fucking thread about china you retards blow in to accuse everyone who doesn't aggressively deepthroat whatever retarded bullshit Navy procurement is up to of being a paid chink agent and it kills discussion by turning it into a shitty flame warnothing is fucking ever getting fixed if idiots like you keep believing that our enemies will just magically fall apart if we have to fight them because america is da best. you are actively burying your head in the sand and insisting the sand isn't even there.
>>65623466>navy procurement will be fixed shitposting on 4tsanching chong ping pong
>>65623466wow i wonder how anyone couldve gotten that impression with the OP pic. if you're going to try to shitpost this way, don't also tip your hand before you even start
>>65622561>n-no le US is le empire so i can make le fall of old empire comparisonsInteresting cope, not reality.
>>65623466>posts inorganic xi meme>n-nooo i’m honest truly>t-taking my concernposting seriously on 4chan will help official US navy procurement!As it turns out a board gets pretty dismissive of a people that have tried to spam propaganda threads on their board for years and years now.If you’re truly angry about the lack if discussion, blame the chinks that made it this way.I M P L E S S I V E
>>65622203The whole us federal gov. Is chink, psy ops at this point.
>>65623506No, it’s not.
>>65623466Shilling for the CCCP won't delete your Japanese rape grand father genes
I cannot wait for the war with China to kick off so I can rape unlimited quantities of Chinese boypussy. If I get put in charge of the prisoner camp, I am going to rape so many Chinese men they are going to have blonde hair in 2 generations.
>>65622203Isn't the Norwegian NSM really fucking expensive for what you get? We could've gone with a ship like the Spanish F-100 for the Constellation program, something that is already full of American equipment. Instead, they decided to go with the Franco-Italian monstrosity full of European equipment.
>>65622593Isn't it just like five billion annually
>>65623726The Soviet Union is dead, bot, the CCCP and CCP are different parties.
>>65622203The requirement for Constellation never existed. The requirement was for LCS, Constellation was the result of Congress boomers throwing a fit about how the LCS couldn't do a bunch of bullshit the USN didn't need it to do.
>>65622203>So the USN needs frigates to counter China's expanding fleetSupport the claim.I don't even necessarily disagree with you, I just want a coherent reasoning so I know how to approach this topic.
>>65623912I'm pretty sure the primary critique of the LCS isn't how it can't do everything ever but rather that they're absolute dogshit and can barely do even the basics without in some cases literally breaking.
>>65623922The USN needs frigates for far more than just China, frigates allow you to project blue water power in scenarios where destroyers and cruisers would be completely unreasonable. An excellent example of this is the Red Sea, an air defence frigate would be a much preferable option to a Burke for shooting down the occasional Houthi missile or drone.
>>65623887>Isn't the Norwegian NSM really fucking expensive for what you get?Not at all, quite the opposite in fact. Where did you get this idea from?
>>65623925>I'm pretty sureAnd yet you are wrong. You have two choices: reflect on your mistakes or double down on your retardation. Which one ever will you choose?
>>65623928>frigates allow you to project blue water power in scenarios where destroyers and cruisers would be completely unreasonableCan't we just follow this reductive logic down to we need individual men with harpoon guns swimming around?Maybe rather than playing these fuck-fuck games you can just lay out your position; that would be swell.
>>65623934I was trying to recall a spreadsheet with various missiles in service to the USN but a quick browser search and it seems like the price is actually fine.
>>65623938I'm not the OP, and trying to counter my argument with a retarded hypothetical is not painting you in the best of lights. Reducing costs and logistical strain is good, and frigates would accomplish this and accomplish it well.
>>65623940The NSM is a fucking steal and if the world ever goes hot again into a major war then we are gonna wish we had more NSM production spooled up.
>>65623944Fuck-fuck games it is then:Men equipped with a 1x harpoon gun and 2x flippers will greatly reduce cost and logistical strain over any conceivable frigate design you can suggest.Offer is still on the table for you to just lay out your position so we can have a productive conversation.
>>65623935>You're wrong despite the fact I haven't actually countered with anything of substance and calling you a retard despite my defending the LCS of all things
>>65623961Wow, I am just SHOCKED. I never would have expected you to make this choice. I have been blindsighted by this unforseeable outcome.
>>65623974Hey, mewling retard, let me put this simply so your tiny mind can comprehend: The LCS is a corvette, the Constellation (if it existed) would be a frigate, even if the LCS were capable of everything it was advertised as (it can't) and could accomplish all of that without breaking down (it can't) then it still wouldn't be able to accomplish what the Constellation could've.
>>65623925The LCS can do everything the Navy needs a small ship to do and a few things they don't. Meanwhile, the Constellation is a very slightly smaller destroyer that costs like a very slightly smaller destroyer, and there's no point in buying them since the Navy already has a better destroyer.
>>65623986My only concern is your characterization as the primary critique of the LCS program being that they break. The Constellation is trash.Also, you should look up "big boy" words before you try and use themhttps://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/mewling
>>65623993This is failing to acknowledge that the Constellation was not intended to be as bloated and retarded as it eventually turned out, it is over 500 tonnes heavier than the heaviest displacement the FREMM could reach and about 1.7k tonnes over the lightest displacement, and that is due to the USN refusing to accept a European frigate with only minor alterations. I said before that they could've chosen the Spanish F-100 and got a 6.5k tonne frigate needing basically zero modifications since it already uses almost entirely American systems and weapons.
>>65624003The irony of pointing to a dictionary when you fail at basic literacy, the LCS classes occasionally breaking down is merely one of their issues, it's just the most funny and memed about. They break, they're expensive, they have too few crew which compounds the maintenance issues, and before the relatively recent armament packages they were hilariously undergunned. And of course they can't do much of what they were advertised as.
>>65624026Its not a literacy issue when you say "primary critique." You're just walking it back now because you look like a retard. Thanks.
>>65624036>the primary critique of the LCS isn't how it can't do everything ever but rather that they're absolute dogshitAnd they are absolute dogshit, thanks for playing.
>>65624006Damage control is not just an afterthought. When Navantia themselves presented the F-100 that already were suggested major alterations to it before the USN even looked at it. The F-100 as-is was never going to fly and it merely demonstrates your lack of authority on the topic when you suggest otherwise.
>>65624006The Constellation became bloated because that's what's required to address the complaints against the LCS, which can be boiled down to "it's not a destroyer." There is no universe in which the Constellation program is a success, because the very inception of the program was politically driven and doesn't reflect the genuine needs of the US Navy.
>>65624039nta but this whole "they are dogshit because i say they are dogshit" angle is really played outwe have had this thread dozens of times and most people are just tired of dealing with itactually say what you think or learn to deal with people just saying you are wrong
>>65622649Is that supposed to be a rebuttal?
>>65623888>10-year Memoranda of Understanding: Current Framework and Structure>The 2016 MOU ($38 Billion): The active agreement, signed under the Obama administration and spanning FY 2019 through FY 2028, pledges a total of $38 billion in military assistance. This includes: $33 billion in Foreign Military Financing (FMF) grants to purchase U.S.-made defense equipment. $5 billion designated for cooperative missile defense programs.$38 billion minimum over ten years, so $3.8 billion annually, not counting humanitarian and economic aid, such as U.S.-Israel Binational Agricultural Research and Development Fund (BARD)>Qualitative military edge - QME has been a conceptual backbone of U.S. military aid to Israel for decades, and it was formally enshrined in U.S. law in 2008. It requires the U.S. government to maintain Israel’s ability “to defeat any credible conventional military threat from any individual state or possible coalition of states or from non-state actors, while sustaining minimal damage and casualties.”https://www.cfr.org/articles/us-aid-israel-four-charts
What proof is there that china is a true blue water fleet? China seems like a powerful green water navy.
>>65622561but enough about china
>>65624332I can't tell if this is unironic or not which is deeply concerning.
>>65624515Implessive
>>65624528Can you bots come up with anything more creative? It's so banal at this point.
>>65624548>Can you bots come up with anything more creative? It's so banal at this point.My thoughts exactly.
>>65624548When you chinkshills show an ounce of creativity then we might think about it. Until then you just haven't been implessive enough
>>65624560I like how the image for your subpar bait post is titled "first EMALS carrier" as if they're late to the party and not the second nation in the world to commission one and the first to launch a 5th gen from it, you're just that unintelligent.
Oh, and just to rub some more salt in the wound for you my little chuddie, the Cheeto in a suit wants to remove the EMALS from the Ford.
>>65622654Their AI bubble imploding is a decent excuse, looking forward to the knock down effects on their already fragile economy
>$196 BILLION for Ukrainenever happened, retard
>>65622203>and our solution is apparently a glorified Coast Guard cutter.you forgot the Trump Battleships
>>65624610implessive, redditor
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